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316'sRegen
14-06-12, 01:47 AM
Here's a Bevchecnko style thread, not seen one in a while :ok:


Looks like another country in the middle east region will descend into civil war.

The west, led by USA and "special relationship" partner UK call for beauracratic sanction type actions with the possibility of entertaining the idea that nothing can be ruled out in regards to actions that may possibly or on the other hand may possibly not happen to "resolve" the situation while the eastern powers Russia and China are politely telling them to mind their own beeswacks and look after their own economically fragile countries.

Russia supplies the Syrian regime with Apache helicopters to kill and maim their own citizens while USA CIA agents and other military and clandestine organisations supplied the whole region with anything they could ever dream of weapons wise since about 1970 or so and expects there to be no consequences.

But is this actually of any importance to us?
Discuss...

Fods
14-06-12, 01:56 AM
Thought this was a thread for a new COD game :D

nirvana
14-06-12, 02:11 AM
Thought it said Sybian.

Fods
14-06-12, 02:20 AM
of course USA will get Involved and then inevitabley England


The Obama administration said Tuesday that Russia is sending attack helicopters to Syrian President Bashar Assad's regime and warned that the Arab country's 15-month conflict could become even deadlier.

Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton said the U.S. was "concerned about the latest information we have that there are attack helicopters on the way from Russia to Syria."

She said the shipment "will escalate the conflict quite dramatically."

Clinton's comments at a public appearance with Israeli President Shimon Peres augured poorly for a peaceful solution to Syria's conflict. Officials from around the world are warning that the violence risks becoming an all-out civil war, with Middle East power brokers from Iran to Turkey possibly being drawn into the fighting.

Diplomatic hopes have rested on Washington and Moscow agreeing on a transition plan that would end the 40-year Assad regime.

But Moscow has consistently rejected the use of outside forces to end the conflict or any international plan to force regime change in Damascus. Despite withering criticism from the West, it insists that any arms it supplies to Syria are not being used to quell anti-government dissent.

With diplomacy at a standstill, the reported shipment of helicopters suggests a dangerous new turn for Syria after more than a year of harsh government crackdowns on mainly peaceful protests and the emergence of an increasingly organized armed insurgency.

There was no immediate reaction from the Russian Foreign Ministry.

Russia and Syria have a longstanding military relationship and Syria hosts Russia's only naval base on the Mediterranean Sea. But in light of the brutal violence, the U.S. has repeatedly demanded that any further deliveries of weaponry be halted. Russian military support in the form of materiel as advanced as attack helicopters would deal a serious blow to efforts to starve the Syrian army of supplies.

Some 13,000 people have died, according to opposition groups, but the U.S. and its allies have been hoping that sanctions on Assad's government and its increased isolation would make it increasingly difficult to carry out military campaigns.

Asked why the Pentagon isn't blocking Russian weapons shipments to Syria, Defense Department officials noted that the administration hasn't declared an arms embargo. Navy Capt. John Kirby, a Pentagon spokesman, accepted the argument that Moscow's resupplying of helicopters enables the regime to kill its own people, but said the key issue is how the Syrians use the materiel.

"Let's not let the Assad regime off the hook here," he told reporters. "The focus really needs to be more on what the Assad regime is doing to its own people, than the cabinets and the closets to which they turn to pull stuff out. It's really about what they're doing with what they've got in their hands."

In recent days, the State Department has decried what it calls "horrific new tactics" by Syrian forces, including helicopters attacks on civilians.

Spokeswoman Victoria Nuland said Clinton's comments referred specifically to new helicopters that were being sent to Syria, and not already existing Russian-made or Soviet-made supplies being used by Assad's government.

"We have been pushing the Russians for months to break their military ties with the Syrian regime and they haven't done it," she told reporters in Washington. "Instead, they keep reassuring all of us that what they are sending militarily to Syria can't be used against civilians.

"But what are we seeing?" Nuland asked. "We are seeing the Syrian government using helicopters to fire on their own people from the air. So our question remains: How can the Russians conscience their continued military sales to Syria?"

Clinton, as well, warned about a massing of Syrian forces near Aleppo over the last two days, saying such a deployment could be a "red line" for Syria's northern neighbor Turkey "in terms of their strategic and national interests."

"We are watching this very carefully," she said.

swedishcmgod
15-06-12, 10:45 AM
nuke syria

Patinoz
15-06-12, 11:14 AM
+1 and while you are at it, move a bit further east too and get rid of the rest.

Elliott
16-06-12, 07:09 AM
When this happened in Libya, we jumped at the chance to kick ass and chew bubblegum. Lack of UN consensus didn't stop us in Iraq either.

All about the oil (or lack thereof).

Craig Forrest
16-06-12, 04:25 PM
I hate the idea of interfering in another country's civil war.... let the countries themselves sort it out...... the people will eventually overthrow a corrupt regime with no help (see Iranian revolution circa 1979) and interfering with the natural progression of things just causes more problems than it fixes....

churky
16-06-12, 04:30 PM
No, we need USA to bring freedom and democracy to everyone. The world can't live without their everlasting love and care.

Patinoz
16-06-12, 04:30 PM
yeah, worked a treat in egypt, didnt it?

churky
16-06-12, 06:48 PM
It's worked everywhere.

Craig Forrest
16-06-12, 09:43 PM
http://joeblow.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/try_and_stop_us.jpg

316'sRegen
18-06-12, 12:08 AM
I hate the idea of interfering in another country's civil war.... let the countries themselves sort it out...... the people will eventually overthrow a corrupt regime with no help (see Iranian revolution circa 1979) and interfering with the natural progression of things just causes more problems than it fixes....

ah, you make me think of the prime directive of starfleet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Directive) with that one CF :lol:

I can't see them sending troops or even trying an air campaign against Syria because Syria has excellent anti aircraft weapomry and an organised well trained army ie it wouldn't be like the previous invasions, it would be a difficult fight to win.

wato20
18-06-12, 01:39 PM
We're America....

Fuck Yeah..

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSjlWg1MQ89gA0rmrAGd_tDfjUShDk2K tFJ1RvgvTlRclI9kvry

Fods
12-07-12, 01:59 PM
This been released yet, sounds great?

djole2mcloud
12-07-12, 02:16 PM
sometimes i ask myself when i see something like this are this people normal...or what...how would you feel that Russia nuke Sweden for some democratic and humanitarian reasons...
Serbia 1999 was the first test field for later NATO crimes in Iraq,Afghanistan,Libya,maybe Syria and Iran...what interest except oil NATO has in Libya,Iraq,Iran...if someone can give me one decent answer i will flush my head in toilet...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SP1foKaXrdc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnUerv1PoxU&feature=related

and many many more...


nuke syria

djole2mcloud
12-07-12, 02:18 PM
well,i don't see USA bother themselves in civil wars in minor African countries...of course...they don't have oil or other natural resources...so,by default...not interested...


I hate the idea of interfering in another country's civil war.... let the countries themselves sort it out...... the people will eventually overthrow a corrupt regime with no help (see Iranian revolution circa 1979) and interfering with the natural progression of things just causes more problems than it fixes....

Craig Forrest
12-07-12, 02:53 PM
Yeah... the Serbs got the hammer dropped on them by NATO.... that's not to say that the Serbs were innocent of course but the other sides also did bad things and committed attrocities.... I remember the KLA doing horrible things to the Serbs as well.... but then they turned and cried to the cameras and made it seem like they were being unfairly victimized by the Serbs so NATO had to help them..... I remember one girl who was crying on TV about how the Serbs had come and killed her family and raped her sister and wouldn't NATO please come do something.... and then after the war they found her with her still alive family and perfectly fine sister... so they asked why she lied and her response was "Well we couldn't beat the Serbs on our own so we needed help from NATO"... or the reports about the Kosavar family that had been kidnapped, tortured and killed and their bodies had been dumped on the side of the road near a Serb town.... that was broadcast on CNN and BBC.... and of course it turns out that the family was fine and nothing like that had actually happened.

..... bottom line is that both sides had people that commited war crimes but only the Serbs seemed to get punished..... NATO and the USA got to test out all kinds of new weapons and equipment and used it as a test run for getting involved in other countries..... the invasion of Iraq destabilised the Iraq/Iran region and the balance of power that had existed, Libya is now being over-run by armed gangs and Islamic terrorist groups since there is no powerful leader/army to stop them, hell, even the once powerful Somali warlords are gone and Islamic terrorists have moved in there too.... not to mention Afghanistan after Soviet and US involvement there.....you can't force democracy on a country.... it has to evolve and the country has to be ready for it.... outside interference just ends up creating more problems than it solves.

Craig Forrest
12-07-12, 02:56 PM
Oh yeah.. I also found this from 2008.... it's a good description/breakdown




Eight years ago, the United States and its NATO allies bombed Serbia to rescue the ethnic Albanian population from genocide at the hands of Serbian troops loyal to Slobodan Milosevic in the southern Serbian province of Kosovo – or so we were told. During the NATO campaign, the State Department told us 100,000 to 500,000 Kosovo-Albanians were missing and feared dead. State Department spokesman James Rubin warned us of "indicators that genocide is unfolding in Kosovo." President Clinton compared Kosovo to Nazi Germany's Holocaust against the Jews. He said Serbia's alleged persecution of Kosovo's ethnic Albanians, like "the ethnic extermination of the Holocaust," was a "vicious, premeditated, systematic oppression fueled by religious and ethnic hatred."
Today Kosovo's Albanian leaders are poised to declare the beleaguered province's independence from Serbian rule and America, along with her allies, stands ready to recognize that independence regardless of Serbia's objections. On the surface, this might appear to be a perfectly reasonable policy; one might assume that Serbia forfeited any right to govern the province when it committed genocide against Kosovo's ethnic Albanian population eight years ago, but things aren't what they appear to be. After eight years of searching, evidence of genocide against Kosovo's ethnic Albanians has not materialized. The number of ethnic Albanians who died or went missing is anywhere from 90 percent to 99 percent lower than the estimates we were given during the war.
Although the Serbs were accused of genocide, and the Albanians were said to be their victims, a Serb was three times more likely to be killed or abducted than an Albanian, and Serbs made-up a disproportionately large share of the Kosovo war's refugees. Kosovo's ethnic Albanians comprise an even larger share of the population today than they did before the war, which adds up to one simple fact: "They weren't victims of genocide". Kosovo was a war over territory that pitted ethnic Albanian secessionists in the Kosovo Liberation Army, or KLA, against Serbian security forces.
To elicit Western sympathy and win NATO intervention against the Serbs, the KLA sought to portray the war as an aggressive Serbian genocide against Kosovo's Albanians – the strategy worked. The shocking images of civilians driven from their homes and streaming out of Kosovo are indelibly burned into our memories. Eve-Ann Prentice, a British journalist who covered the Kosovo war for the Guardian and the London Times, testified during Slobodan Milosevic's trial in the Hague. She said that rather than being driven out by the Serbs, "The KLA told ethnic Albanian civilians that it was their patriotic duty to leave because the world was watching. This was their one big opportunity to make Kosovo part of Albania eventually, that NATO was there, ready to come in, and that anybody who failed to join the exodus was not supporting the Albanian cause."
Alice Mahon, a British MP and a member of the NATO Parliamentary Assembly in Brussels, also testified during Milosevic's trial. She said, " The KLA definitely encouraged the exodus." Muharem Ibraj and Saban Fazliu, two ethnic Albanian witnesses from Kosovo who testified in Milosevic's trial, said Serbian security forces encouraged civilians to remain in their homes, and that it was the KLA who made the civilian population leave the province. Fazliu testified that the KLA would KILL anybody who disobeyed its orders. He said, "The order was to leave Kosovo in later stages, to go to Albania, Macedonia, so that the WORLD could see for themselves that the Albanians are leaving because of the harm caused by the Serbs. This was the aim. This was the KLA order."
During the war, the London Times reported how "KLA 'minders' ensured that all refugees peddled the same line when speaking to Western journalists" by threatening the refugee's loved ones. Unfortunately, that report was one of the few honest pieces of journalism to come out of Kosovo. Testifying in the Milosevic trial about the coverage he had seen in the Western news media, Dietmar Hartwig, the chief of the European Union's Monitoring Mission in Kosovo said, "I didn't think it had anything to do with reality. [The] reporting was always very one-sided." In addition to biased coverage of the Kosovo war, our news media may have deliberately misled public opinion by staging fake news footage designed to make the plight of the refugees look worse than it actually was.
Goran Stojcik, a Macedonian ambulance driver who worked in the refugee camps during the war, testified under oath at the Hague Tribunal that he had eye-witnessed Western news crews stage-managing fake news footage in the refugee camps. He said, "CNN was the most prominent in stage managing things that were to be filmed." He gave examples of news crews coaching refugees on how to act in front of the cameras. In one example, he said a news crew threw a refugee child into the mud to make him cry for the camera.
On another occasion, he said his colleague's medical supplies were stolen so a perfectly healthy man could be wrapped in bandages and placed on a stretcher to be portrayed as wounded in front of the TV cameras. At a minimum, the media was Quick to report accusations against the Serbs that later turned out not to be true. There were reports that the Serbs were running a concentration camp at the Pristina soccer stadium, and that they were butchering Albanians by the thousands and burning their remains in the Trepca mining complex, but NONE of it turned out to be true. We were conned into being the KLA's air force. Our compassion and our sympathy for human suffering was abused and turned into a weapon of war by a group of sadistic terrorists who abused the very people they claimed to protect!
The KLA has been credibly linked to Osama bin Laden. In 1998, Fatos Klosi, the head of SHIK (Albania's intelligence service), told London's Sunday Times newspaper that bin Laden had visited Albania to send units to fight in Kosovo. In 1999, the Washington Times reported that it had obtained intelligence documents that showed a "link" between bin Laden and the KLA – including a common staging area in Tropoje, Albania, a center for Islamic terrorists.
It was no secret that the "KLA was a terrorist group". In 1998, Robert Gelbard, the U.S. special envoy for Kosovo, told the Agence France Presse wire service that "the KLA is, without any questions, a terrorist group!" One doesn't have to look any further than the public communiqués that the KLA freely published in the Albanian media in the years and months leading up to the war to see that they started the war, NOT Slobodan Milosevic or the Serbian authorities. Two years before the war started, the KLA published a communiqué in the Albanian media that said, "Through this communiqué, we would like to state clearly to the current Serbian political leadership that they must withdraw from our territories as soon as possible, or our attacks to liberate the country will be fierce and merciless."
One year before the war started, the KLA published another communiqué threatening the international community with "a greater slaughter than in Bosnia-Herzegovina" and warning the Serbs of a fate "worse than their Russian brothers in Afghanistan and Chechnya" unless their demands were met.
To keep the ethnic Albanian civilian population from cooperating with the Serbian authorities, KLA communiqués openly threatened "Death to enemies and traitors." One communiqué said, "Operations were carried out against Albanian collaborationists, who, despite earlier warnings, did not abandon their courses of action."

The KLA openly boasted of how it murdered ethnic Albanian "collaborators." In one communiqué they explained how they killed an ethnic Albanian named Hetem Dobruna because of his "notorious and open collaboration" with the Serbian authorities in Kosovo.
In another communiqué they took credit for the murder of an ethnic Albanian named Dalip Dugolli who they called "a collaborator and one of Milosevic's most trusted men" before explaining how "Kosovo and the other Albanian territories will not be liberated down the telephone or from an office, but only by a serious commitment in support of the armed struggle."
Three out of the last four prime ministers elected in Kosovo were senior members of the KLA. Kosovo's current prime minister, Hashim Thaci, was the leader of the KLA.

djole2mcloud
12-07-12, 05:18 PM
please,one more thing...it is not Kosovo,it is Kosovo and Metohija...USA and all NATO members directly avoid this full name...the root of this two words gives a proof that this is Serbian land over 1200 years...a log before Albanians even appear on Blakan...Kosovo= Kos (the black bird) in full translation Land where black birds live...Metohija=Metoh(ancient Greek word for ''the Church Land'',so this is ultimate proof for Kosovo's Serbian and Orthodox Christian past...Further,there are no Kosovar's,such thing is a lie...on Kosovo and Metohija there was a many different nationalities...Albanians,Serbs,Gypsies(Christian and Muslim Gypsies),Egyptians...
no one here in Serbia denies crimes commited against some of Albanian people...but there are only isolated incidents and not genocide as NATO says...Kosovo and Metohija is a part of Serbia,and one part of people raise arms and start with killing of regular Serbian police and military...let's say now in USA,Texas declare independance and their new formed army start killing regular USA troops...here is the link with German map of Serbian empire in 1330...you'll see that Kosovo and Metohija was even then part of Serbia...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/Balkans_in_1350_according_to_Gustav_Droysen_from_1 9th_century.jpg




Yeah... the Serbs got the hammer dropped on them by NATO.... that's not to say that the Serbs were inn
ocent of course but the other sides also did bad things and committed attrocities.... I remember the KLA doing horrible things to the Serbs as well.... but then they turned and cried to the cameras and made it seem like they were being unfairly victimized by the Serbs so NATO had to help them..... I remember one girl who was crying on TV about how the Serbs had come and killed her family and raped her sister and wouldn't NATO please come do something.... and then after the war they found her with her still alive family and perfectly fine sister... so they asked why she lied and her response was "Well we couldn't beat the Serbs on our own so we needed help from NATO"... or the reports about the Kosavar family that had been kidnapped, tortured and killed and their bodies had been dumped on the side of the road near a Serb town.... that was broadcast on CNN and BBC.... and of course it turns out that the family was fine and nothing like that had actually happened.

..... bottom line is that both sides had people that commited war crimes but only the Serbs seemed to get punished..... NATO and the USA got to test out all kinds of new weapons and equipment and used it as a test run for getting involved in other countries..... the invasion of Iraq destabilised the Iraq/Iran region and the balance of power that had existed, Libya is now being over-run by armed gangs and Islamic terrorist groups since there is no powerful leader/army to stop them, hell, even the once powerful Somali warlords are gone and Islamic terrorists have moved in there too.... not to mention Afghanistan after Soviet and US involvement there.....you can't force democracy on a country.... it has to evolve and the country has to be ready for it.... outside interference just ends up creating more problems than it solves.

swedishcmgod
12-07-12, 05:33 PM
sometimes i ask myself when i see something like this are this people normal...or what...how would you feel that Russia nuke Sweden for some democratic and humanitarian reasons...


I think the main problem is that I have no sympathy for women-hating, stone-throwing, religious-literalism-believing cunts who spend all their day taking siestas and torturing each other. We've been war-free since the 19th century (with exception of a few UN-soldiers) and we built up our country to a democratic and equal society. I have no patience for people who cannot learn how to behave when it's fecking 2012 and do not contribute at all to mankind. That's also why I have no patience with Palestine and the rest of those "high-achievers". Fucking sick of all this bullshit so my answer is simply:



nuke syria

djole2mcloud
12-07-12, 07:06 PM
okey...nuke sweden than also...


I think the main problem is that I have no sympathy for women-hating, stone-throwing, religious-literalism-believing cunts who spend all their day taking siestas and torturing each other. We've been war-free since the 19th century (with exception of a few UN-soldiers) and we built up our country to a democratic and equal society. I have no patience for people who cannot learn how to behave when it's fecking 2012 and do not contribute at all to mankind. That's also why I have no patience with Palestine and the rest of those "high-achievers". Fucking sick of all this bullshit so my answer is simply:

nirvana
12-07-12, 07:13 PM
Threaten to nuke Israel, so they do actually nuke everyone and put an end to the world.

swedishcmgod
12-07-12, 07:18 PM
okey...nuke sweden than also...
if Sweden turns out like Syria, go right ahead, I would have already left sweden if that was the case :ok:

djole2mcloud
12-07-12, 08:28 PM
the main thing is that we don't no anything going on there...we only see one side of a story...American side...


if Sweden turns out like Syria, go right ahead, I would have already left sweden if that was the case :ok:

Craig Forrest
13-07-12, 03:26 AM
easy... the Syrians don't like their leader so they are trying to overthrown him and in return, he is ordering his army to crush them.... if they truly had the support of the population, the army would not obey, they would defect to the rebel's side, and Bashar al-Assad would be gone.... just like happened in Egypt recently and in Iran during the revolution.... the problem is that the US and others have been jumping at the chance to get rid of people the don't like so they interfere and make things worse.

Aula
29-08-13, 11:08 AM
British, US and French troops are waiting for an order to attack Syria.

The decision is going to be made in few days, if not in hours.

Russian political scientist: "If USA is going to attack Syria, Russia is going to invade balticum".

Makes no sence what so ever, another conspiracy that involves USA organising chemical weapon usages in Syria?

Ste117
29-08-13, 01:11 PM
Ive been reading this too and about the US conspiracy around it all, this could provoke world war, with Russia and China allying with Syria, could be a standoff of the worlds big powers, this is not good, hope Cameron sees senseband stays out of it all but I gather he is under pressure from the US also

316'sRegen
29-08-13, 01:23 PM
The weapons that were detonated last week were most likely obtained by Al Qaeda during the September 11th attack in Benghazi on the embassy that killed the US diplomat and 3 spec ops fighters. The story goes that the weapons were to be handed over but that the ambassador said no. He didn't want to basically arm Al Qaeda. And so he had to die. US military had several UAVs in the area and could have easily dispersed (destroyed) the mob outside their embassy. They chose not to and stood down, so that the weapons would be in the hands of the crazies.

It was then only a matter of time before Al Qaeda used the weapons, at which point the allied forces would have to rush to the "aid" of the Syrian people.

These fuckers are so many steps ahead but the main problem is that 70% of the world population would rather watch football or fucking Eastenders or Miley Slutis shake her hole on MTV awards than know what is actually going on. This type of mindless existence is the reason the world is in so much danger.

edit: what can I do about it, I'm only 1 person?
Today I rang my MP for the first time ever and made sure his office knew that East Belfast expects him to vote NO on any action. Sounds like a silly useless thing to do , but if everyone took 5 minutes, that's all it takes, to ring their MP and jam up the switchboards it will show these fuckers that they work for us and that we are fucking fed up

Blue Demon
29-08-13, 04:20 PM
Typical false flag this. Can`t wait for the fabricated `evidence`.

Craig Forrest
29-08-13, 08:01 PM
Either way (I'm not getting involved in if this was a legit chemical attack by Assad's government, a false flag, or something else) I object to getting involved in another country's civil war.... so if they USA and allies attack, how long before Al Qaeda linked groups are the ones filling the power vacuum?

FFS, if a country's government is corrupt, the people will eventually gather enough momentum to rise up and overthrow them without outside interference.... it may take years and plenty of blood but it will happen if enough of the people are for it.... other countries sticking their noses in and getting involved just cause problems....

Osprey17
30-08-13, 12:25 AM
I'm not buying the conspiracy theories, they don't hold up to any real rational analysis. The ideas of a potential World War are just as fanciful. The Korean War, the Cuban Missile Crisis, Vietnam and the 1983 Russian sub computer failure each show that we have come far closer to nuclear war than this and not blown ourselves into oblivion. Also the military strikes being planned are more like the ones we used in Serbia in the late 90's, not the 2003 Gulf conflict or the 2001 Afghanistan comparisons being drawn.

Assad's government in Syria is desperate, it's fighting itself into a stalemate and has lost many of its high-ranking chain-of-command generals to defections or killed in combat. To keep its armed forces together it needs to score some quick victories that either keep the morale high or keep people from deserting. Many other dictators have done the same throughout history, so if they had the nerve gas why (from Assad's point of view) wouldn't they use it? Considering if they lose they'll end up dead as a result of a rebel victory. The rebel forces themselves are smaller and have a less rigidly structured chain-of-command so can cope with such losses better without it affecting their military operations.

As for the sabre-rattling, particularly in Britain it's the result of Politician's logic. We need to do something. This is something. Therefore we must do it. This combined with a public that would complain that we should do something about it and not do something about whichever way the government decides to go with deal.

It's also worrying how everyone in media circles suddenly becomes an expert on UN Law during these times.

For the record, I'd prefer that we all stayed out of it. It would not end well either way.

316'sRegen
30-08-13, 05:17 AM
Assad is/was not losing mate, that's why I'm sure they didn't do the chem attacks. He's been winning for months.
It's a desperation move by the CIA/Al Qa'eda. (which is one and the same thing)

dryrain
30-08-13, 11:07 AM
Saw Cameron got defeated last night on his vote. There are so many countries where there is conflict going on. We have stood by for 2 years and not done anything. I never like to see this kind of conflict but its the why the world works and the arms industry as they say there is no profit in peace. America has always had a beef with syria now is his opportunity to do something about it. But if he does intervene it could widen the conflict, Israel, Iran they will all want to strike against each other.

Osprey17
30-08-13, 11:07 AM
Assad is/was not losing mate, that's why I'm sure they didn't do the chem attacks.

I said that Assad was fighting towards a stalemate not that he was losing, if that stalemate can't be broken then in the long run this will favour the rebel forces due to their less rigid command structure. Assad has been trying to change his command structure into one that can utilises militia better but this has had limited success.


He's been winning for months.

I'm guessing you mean the Al-Qusayr offensive and the link up with the Lebanese border here? Well those both ended in June, and the Lebanese offensive was only possible with the support of Hezbollah. Even during this period the gains were modest and the government has shifted it's military objectives from one of recapturing the whole of Syria and crushing the rebellion to one of holding or taking key strategic areas. That is not a campaign employed by a government that is 'winning' that's a government that wants to be in the better position when it goes to the negotiating table.

Furthermore, since the two offensives I have listed above, the rebel forces have taken the southern city of Nawa, the Menagh military airbase and, most crucially, the town of Khanasir 4 days ago which means they now have cut-off all the government supply routes into Aleppo. None of these things are signs that the government is 'winning' by any means.


It's a desperation move by the CIA/Al Qa'eda. (which is one and the same thing)

This is just plain daft. But even if we believed this for a second, the timeline doesn't tie up with the use of banned ballistic/SCUD missiles by the government (which were bought from the USSR and later Russia btw). Nor does it tie up with Syrian chemical weapons tests/movements that occurred last year. Syria is also one of only 5 nations that have not signed the Chemical Weapons Convention - the others being Egypt, North Korea, Angola and South Sudan (which to be fair has only existed for a year and therefore has a lot of UN paperwork to catch up on) and admitted to having them last year.

Even if we overcome all the logical problems there, the conspiracy theory still has to account for why they would go to all the trouble of getting them from Libya (and move them without anyone else noticing) when it would be easier to obtain them in their own destabilised country.

And if that is not enough to dispel the conspiracy, then it has to account for why only 1 person in an operation that would have needed thousands involved to make it possible, actually turned around and said no and that operation went perfectly to plan without any hitches despite all the possible ways it could have gone wrong. That takes the credibility factor into the realms of unicorns and fantasy.

316'sRegen
30-08-13, 11:47 AM
I didn't think it was the missiles that were banned seeing as we have shitloads of those ICBMs and the like. It was the payload not being of a chemical nature that the world agreed on after WW1, wasn't it? They've got a load of missiles there from Benghazi like I said, that isn't in doubt. How hard would it be to make them chemical payloads?

Also, Do UK/EU states have such weapons?

Stuff being moved around is only what the allied governments/mainstream news (which once again are one and the same thing) are telling us happened. I don't get my news from there any more why would you believe something that is basically state run media? We have know way of knowing for sure if that is true or not yet, bring on the UN inspectors til we see what they say. (UN stated goal is one world government though :doh:)

I don't understand your last paragraph :confused: but saying that CIA don't run Al Qa'eda and that it is a silly thing to say shows me we'll never agree on this anyway. Fuck sake Bin Laden himself was a CIA man :lol: the group was created in the 70's by the CIA to fight Russia in Afghanistan. There is no denying the links between the Bin Laden and the Bush families and that the Bin Laden's were famously flown out of America on 9/11.

I am glad our government in the UK listened to the people though. David Cameron isn't as stupid as I thought.

I am surprised at how stupid you think Assad is, Osprey. Do you honestly believe he invited weapons inspectors in and then unleashed illegal banned weapons the very next day? I know he is a dictator and not a loving leader, but those type of people are usually more cunning than this. I refuse to believe he would destroy his own arguments within the international community by being so idiotic.

edit: go back and look at what they were saying about Saddam before destroying his country.

Osprey17
30-08-13, 04:17 PM
As you say we're not going to agree on this, so this will be my last post on the topic unless I'm specifically asked to explain something I've already said as these sort of discussions can never end well.


I didn't think it was the missiles that were banned seeing as we have shitloads of those ICBMs and the like. It was the payload not being of a chemical nature that the world agreed on after WW1, wasn't it? They've got a load of missiles there from Benghazi like I said, that isn't in doubt. How hard would it be to make them chemical payloads?

Also, Do UK/EU states have such weapons?

No we don't have active cluster bombs in the UK (I say active as in we have some in the process of being decommissioned) as we signed up to the Convention on Cluster Munitions back in 2008. Syria have not signed up to this treaty. There are some nations in the EU that have not signed up to this agreement, namely Poland, Romania, Cyprus, Greece and Latvia, though I'm no expert on all of these nation's military capabilities I can be sure that Cyprus and Latvia do not have them. We do not have Scud missiles either as they are of USSR/Russia construction.

Yes, the world agreed to ban chemical payloads after the end of World War 1 - some 74 years after World War 1 had ended in 1992.

I'll come to the Benghazi stuff later on.


Stuff being moved around is only what the allied governments/mainstream news (which once again are one and the same thing) are telling us happened. I don't get my news from there any more why would you believe something that is basically state run media? We have know way of knowing for sure if that is true or not yet, bring on the UN inspectors til we see what they say. (UN stated goal is one world government though :doh:)

If you consider what the Russian government is saying 'an allied government' source, then I don't think it is possible to reason with you. The Syrians have been in discussions with Russia over where its chemical weapons are since the conflict began and it was the Russians that brokered the communications between Syria and the US over them. The Russians have just as much concern over where these end up, they don't want them falling into the hands of say... Chechnyan/Daegastani rebels. Also as Russia is the main supplier of Syria's military equipment it does not make sense for the Syrians to mislead the Russian government.

I don't recall having ever said that I believe in something that is state run media. I've been advocating allowing the UN inspectors to do the job since my first post in here. Though you don't seem to trust them either, so whatever happens in the end I don't see how you will be happy with the result.

Finally, wasn't all the Benghazi tuff revealed in the US' mass-media? Came up on CNN if I'm not mistaken, then Fox ran away with it. If you say you can't trust mainstream news outlets you can't suddenly use it when it suits the political narrative you would prefer. Also why haven't openly anti-US news agencies such as RT been riding this US cover-up wave? Again the logic doesn't hold up.


I don't understand your last paragraph :confused: but saying that CIA don't run Al Qa'eda and that it is a silly thing to say shows me we'll never agree on this anyway. Fuck sake Bin Laden himself was a CIA man :lol: the group was created in the 70's by the CIA to fight Russia in Afghanistan. There is no denying the links between the Bin Laden and the Bush families and that the Bin Laden's were famously flown out of America on 9/11.

I am glad our government in the UK listened to the people though. David Cameron isn't as stupid as I thought.

I am sorry if I didn't make my last paragraph clear enough, but I'll try and do so again. I said the idea that this is a desperation move from the CIA/Al-Qaeda was silly particularly when there are more believeable and realistic alternative explanations available. To list in order of likeliness, either Assad used them to try and break the military stalement he's heading towards or the rebels did it to themselves using captured military equipment and the Saudi-owned chemical production factory they captured last December. Either is possible, but neither myself or anyone here can make that call. Some CIA/Al-Qaeda conspiracy is way down on the list of possible explanations simply because of the logisitics involved and the number of ways it could have gone wrong.


I am surprised at how stupid you think Assad is, Osprey. Do you honestly believe he invited weapons inspectors in and then unleashed illegal banned weapons the very next day? I know he is a dictator and not a loving leader, but those type of people are usually more cunning than this. I refuse to believe he would destroy his own arguments within the international community by being so idiotic.

edit: go back and look at what they were saying about Saddam before destroying his country.

History has proven that many dictators would be willing to kill their own side as part of desperate moves as part of military conflict, but I'm going to wait until the weapons inspectors make that call. What I haven't said is that I think Assad is stupid, you don't rule a country for 42 years by being stupid - desperate maybe for reasons I've listed in other posts. Desperate does not equate to stupidity.

Also I don't get why you want to drag me back to the Saddam example, mainly because there have been more conflicts in the region we've been involved in than that one and the rhetoric doesn't match with it at all. The actions and rhetoric done before the Kosovo/Serbia conflict is the closest match. Russia went to great lengths to condemn that as well and in the end did nothing as NATO performed airstrikes all over Belgrade, lots of which the scars are still there today.

Considering this is the only vaguely political thread I've posted in on here I don't see how I could anyone could have enough information at hand to determine my politics/sources of political information. I'm sorry to say that my views are not the ones you would like.

316'sRegen
31-08-13, 10:32 AM
Never be sorry for your own views :lol:
If I seem ignorant or rude I am not trying to be, I just have strong views on this stuff.

The benghazi stuff wasn't "revealed" on the mainstream channels though mate. Yes they did it about a year later after the likes of Infowars had on various military guests debunking the originial story. Don't you remember the pathetic version of events we were supposed to swallow that a movie which was slanderous to mohammed or muslims was released on youtube, and this was the catalyst or even the cause of the Benghazi attack. Has this been forgotten? Over the last year or two it has become the standard procedure that the mainstream media try to put out their versions of stories or their propaganda, then the alternative media sources look at things more closely and with a critical eye and bring out the real story. Once the masses see that indeed the truth isn't what the mainstream sources was selling, then the likes of CNN and Fox have to change their minds and show the truth, usually months later though. I'll try and lay out a few examples of this if anyone is interested.

As for CIA being Al Qa'eda and being highly active in that region on the ground controlling the militants that is what I believe. I truly think they are out there whipping up hatred and destabalising the whole region (so that we have to go and sort it out)

The Saudis have been mentioned as well today in some sources as possible backers/armers of these "rebels" but Saudi Arabia was set up by Britain anyway and they have always been a Western outpost in the region, so not really surprising but let's wait and see what the inspectors come out with. (In 2 weeks :eek:)

I mentioned Saddam before because the wave of hype and media call to arms felt the exact same to me as when they were spouting the "he can kill the whole world in 45 mins" angle, that was all.

info0
31-08-13, 01:52 PM
USA is lying, again to cover up their operations. Remember Iraq having nuclear weapons? Yeah... That sort of truth. ;)

Look at Egypt now. They got rid of dictator, yet the situation is faaaaaaaaaaaaar worse than when he was in charge. Don't you feel same shit will happen in Syria? Assad may be bad guy, but if terrorists get charge in country, all Hell will break loose.

Russia is portrayed as bad guys here, for God knows what reason. It's not in USA judgement to war invade another country. If this happens I really do hope Nobel committee revokes Obama Peace Noble Prize...

United Nations act up.

316'sRegen
31-08-13, 02:35 PM
good point about Egypt.

They threw out Mubarak, then gave the Egyptian people two choices, one of the guys from the Mubarak regime, or a muslim brotherhood representitive (Morsi). No choice at all really and when Morsi didn't bring the people along with him (they did give him a year to try) the army had to step in to prevent all out mayhem. Military rule is never good, but I do thin they were left little choice in that case.

The whole arab spring uprising seems to have been manufactured the more we look at it.

Considering the decades it takes for democracies to form naturally it isn't really shocking that these places are in disorder as they shake loose the chains of years of despotism, it is disgusting though how increasingly reports are showing that the western security services either started the revolutions in the first place, or are trying to steer them towards their own favourable outcomes, be it putting their man in (afghan) or putting in a Muslim Brotherhood operative (Egypt) to later be the reason we must attack.

djole2mcloud
01-09-13, 06:23 PM
we in Serbia understand West,specially ''US'' democracy...fabricating evidence,and other stuff...collateral damage,killing innocent people for their own interests...
1999 can't be erased and savage bombing of our country...after Serbia(back than still was Yugoslavia names used),they went to Iraq,Libya...
before US strike against Libya,for 1 (one) EUR you could buy 17 litres of the finest petrol there...and there is a lot of other benefits for their citizens from Libyan government...
after the US intervention,first time in Libyan history you can see beggars on the streets of Tripoli...
so,i say,leave every country to settle they own problems inside their borders...

Blue Demon
02-09-13, 07:32 PM
Either way (I'm not getting involved in if this was a legit chemical attack by Assad's government, a false flag, or something else) I object to getting involved in another country's civil war.... so if they USA and allies attack, how long before Al Qaeda linked groups are the ones filling the power vacuum?

FFS, if a country's government is corrupt, the people will eventually gather enough momentum to rise up and overthrow them without outside interference.... it may take years and plenty of blood but it will happen if enough of the people are for it.... other countries sticking their noses in and getting involved just cause problems....

When can we expect this to happen in the US, UK, France etc. ? :D

ozRooster
07-09-13, 01:03 AM
http://i.imgur.com/Cu6E0wI.png

Fods
07-09-13, 01:10 AM
Charlie Daniels: A Citizen's Take on Syria

In my soon to be 77 years as a citizen of the United States of America, having lived through Japan's sneak attack on Pearl Harbor, the dark days of WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Watergate, 9/11 and all the other serious and profound events our beloved nation has been involved in over the last three quarters of a century, I have to say with all sincerity that I have never seen a president as confused, befuddled, impotent, insincere and as out of his depth as Barack Obama has become in dealing with the Syrian issue.

When you're the leader of the free world, you don't make statements you can't back up and you don't draw lines in the sand, watch your enemies cross them with impunity and go off and play a round of golf.

Obama painted himself and the nation into a corner with his “red line” statement and I truly believe he thought he would have unilateral international and domestic support only to find himself standing alone in the spotlight with egg on his face and a ticking political time bomb in his hand.

I don't believe he ever had any intention of going through Congress and only decided to do so when he was left without the support of traditional allies and the disdain of a war weary American public who have begun to feel that America cannot be the international police force who has to bear the brunt of every catastrophe.

I think Obama is taking the vote for military authorization to Congress to bail himself out, to buy some time, somebody to share the blame if all goes wrong. Obama had already positioned war ships. All that was left to do was give the order to fire the missiles and at the 11th hour, after being rejected by the British parliament and put off by the French, he started having second thoughts and reached for the life preserver.

I, for one, am glad that Obama - for whatever reason - political expediency notwithstanding, did not facilitate the missile attack as it would have been largely symbolic and cosmetic and as he had given Assad enough warning to move the weapons out of harms way would have done little if anything to rid the world of chemical weapons.

It's not that I think nothing should be done about weapons of mass destruction no matter where they're used in the world, but I believe it's not just the responsibility of the United States to enforce international law. If the civilized nations of the world shirk this duty, why should they think America should take on the job by itself?

America has done enough "sending signals", symbolic gestures, getting involved in situations that don't threaten our national interests or that of our allies.

America's leaders should guard their tongues well and not issue spur of the moment reactions and empty threats. Our bite should be a lot worse than our bark and a presidential warning should be a dire and solemn caution, issued only once and followed up with swift and decisive action, not some half-baked puff of bravado that nobody really takes seriously.

What little bit of credibility America had in the Middle East just went out the window Friday afternoon, as a president who let his ego overload his common sense backed down from a tin horned dictator of a third world country, or at least that's how it's viewed in that part of the world.

The mettle of a president and the people he surrounds himself with is not proven until push comes to shove. This nation has entered a new phase in the war on terror and our relativity in the rest of the world and the road is going to be long, rocky and dangerous.

It remains to be seen how this embarrassing situation will play out. Will the president seek the council of the more experienced advice available to him in Congress? Or, will he remain defiant and continue to go it alone.

You've cost America a great deal this past week, Mr. President.

ZanSnake
07-09-13, 03:28 AM
Fuck Nuclear war! Fuck World War 3!

If it was in my mind then ever would be dancing to 90's Eurohouse music!!!

Yay!

Music>Politics!

Blue Demon
07-09-13, 09:13 AM
I dont understand how anyone can doubt that the ÜS will attack Syria. They only prefer to attack with permission of allies, but if needed they will invent an ally. They are going to attack, no matter what the world wants, no matter what congress says.

316'sRegen
07-09-13, 11:13 AM
:lol: they create the enemy, but it looks like allies are few and far between, their public opinion is heavily against any military action now as well.

I missed what their house said the other day, the whole thing was overshadowed by the pumpkin head McCain playing poker, it all feels a bit like a school assembly :)

The no agenda guys had another view on the situation. They were saying the Syria strike may eventually be used as a bargaining chip by the USA. What for you ask? America could say something like:

"OK, We'll not attack Syria as long as you buy your gas from uncle Sam and not Vladimir Putin"

They have no reservation in USA about fracking, they are looking at it as their way out of recession and would have vast supplies of the shale gas untapped within their borders.

Watching John Kerry do his best warmongering efforts this last week I don't think this is the case.
I'm off to read about the St. Petersburg G20 and see what came out of that.

Blue Demon
07-09-13, 01:36 PM
They do create an enemy, but they will certainly try to create an ally this time too. Something drastic in 9/11 style to get people to support a war, or even so they can claim US is being attacked.

316'sRegen
07-09-13, 02:21 PM
Yeah that's another way they could go. Senator Lindsay Graham yesterday warned that there could be a nuclear attack. He even gave 2 possible locations. Bloody hilarious these Yankees

Blue Demon
07-09-13, 02:30 PM
I heared from 2 sources already that warheads have been moved without a paper trail.

316'sRegen
07-09-13, 02:34 PM
Aye they were moved off some base that the bosses didn't even know held the weapons. Supposedly heading to North Carolina. Very scary this, especially when you listen to Kerry Hagel McCain Graham and the rest. They sound determined.

djole2mcloud
07-09-13, 07:43 PM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/p526x296/1184947_10151655097941840_1026027557_n.jpg

ZanSnake
08-09-13, 03:44 AM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/p526x296/1184947_10151655097941840_1026027557_n.jpg

rEMINDS ME OF THE xZIBIT mEME

:lol:

316'sRegen
15-09-13, 10:41 AM
Vladimir Putin, leader of the free world?

WTF is happening? :lol:

Blue Demon
16-09-13, 02:26 PM
The least we can do is hand over Obama`s peace prize to him.

Blue Demon
09-10-13, 12:30 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_FvmrvREUA


Errrr, you were meant to say `chemical weapon`, not `napalm`.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNFfceAwZsM

316'sRegen
10-10-13, 09:06 AM
:ok:

I heard they started destroying the weapons yesterday

Bevchenko
26-06-14, 11:45 PM
President Barack Obama has asked the US Congress to approve $500m (£294m) to train and equip what he described as "moderate" Syrian opposition forces.

The funds would help Syrians defend against forces aligned with President Bashar al-Assad, the White House said.

The aid would also counter Islamist militants such as the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant (Isis), it added.

Isis's advance in neighbouring Iraq has led some in Congress to press Mr Obama to take action.

Tens of thousands of people have died and millions more have been displaced in three years of civil war in Syria, as rebels fight troops loyal to Mr Assad.

"This funding request would build on the administration's longstanding efforts to empower the moderate Syrian opposition, both civilian and armed," the White House said.

It will also "enable the Department of Defense to increase our support to vetted elements of the armed opposition".

The money will help stabilise areas under opposition control and counter terrorist threats, the White House said.

The rebels that would receive the funds would be vetted beforehand in order to alleviate concerns of equipment falling into the hands of militants hostile to the US and its allies, the White House said.

Mr Obama has been under strong pressure from some members of Congress to increase assistance in the area.

Last month Mr Obama hinted at increased help for the Syrian opposition in a speech at the military academy at West Point.

He said he would work with Congress to "ramp up support for those in the Syrian opposition who offer the best alternative to terrorists and a brutal dictator".








and so it begins, enter USA....

Dermotron
30-09-15, 03:47 PM
Hon the Russians

merkezekrem
01-10-15, 12:45 PM
USA abondoned the training program. First group of trainees got captured by El-Nusra, second group joined El-Nusra and so on...

Craig Forrest
01-10-15, 07:34 PM
Russians will do what the west hasn't/ Airstrikes, backed up by forces on the ground (Syrian, Iranian, Iraqi, Hezbollah) with Russian equipment and trainers..... they'll hurt ISIS and push back all the anti-Assad groups that are currently fighting, allowing the Syrian government time to reclaim some territory and re-establish themselves as an effective anti-extremist fighting force.

Until the Western countries grow some balls and also put troops on the ground, the new Russian alliance will have to take care of things

They've also met with Saudi, Turkish, and Israeli government officials to try and coordinate things.... at this rate, US influence in the Middle East will fall and they'll be replaced by the Russians

djole2mcloud
01-10-15, 10:18 PM
hail to that...tired of watching americans introduce democracy in last 20 yrs or so...

Bevchenko
02-10-15, 05:22 AM
Putin has his uses.

Mark
02-10-15, 09:25 AM
Surprised to see Putin getting involved considering his stance on other matters!

info0
02-10-15, 01:58 PM
Putin supports Assad, so no chance he wouldn't get involved.

Also funny, USA gave weapon to Syria rebels, but... They joined IS army instead with USA weaponry :D. USA plan backfired as usual :lol:.

If I was EU governing body I would do what Orban does in Hungary, use force against them refugees. So much shit going on in media trying to make them look like they are hurting, but it's not the truth. They come here only because of guaranteed social life (Germans pay HUGE chunk of money). You think they will go to work? LOL.

Also show me proof there are KIDS and WOMEN coming here. Rarely saw that. Only see young men, who should be fighting for their COUNTRY, but instead they flee. Bunch of pussies!

Shoot them down. The problem would be solved. Accepting that shit into Europe will bring disaster in long run. Can't wait to see terrorist attacks in major cities and then EU governing body to panic about ISIS... Look at Brussels (right now, most dangerous European country due to... islam/muslims).

Craig Forrest
02-10-15, 02:29 PM
A) The US trained rebels joined Al-Nusra which is Al-Qaeda's affiliate that is actually fighting against IS.... but yes, another failure by the US

B) I'm tired of your bigoted, insensitive, borderline racism. You're a prick. The Hungarians are despicable, given how the world opened their arms to Hungarian refugees fleeing in the 1950s. Even the Serbs are treating the refugees properly which surprised a lot of people in this part of the world, given their reputation.

As for your assertion that the men fleeing are pussies, it must be nice to be in a nice, safe country with no real issues and no real threats. If you lived in a war zone and had a family that you wanted to keep alive, chances are you would get the hell out of there too. And it's mostly women and children actually, but why let facts get in the way of your arrogant bigoted views about immigrants and refugees. People like you are part of the reason why the world is so fucked up. You care about no one but yourself.

http://www.bipedsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/syria-refugees-1.jpg

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Environment/Pix/pictures/2013/8/30/1377858355809/Syrian-refugees-011.jpg

http://i.cbc.ca/1.3215851.1441381460!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/16x9_620/syrian-refugee-crisis.jpg

http://america.aljazeera.com/content/dam/ajam/images/articles/Syria_Refugee_101713.jpg

People like you are fucking scum.... advocating to shoot people fleeing a deadly war zone and risking their lives to try and provide a better life for themselves and their families.

Go crawl back under your rock.

info0
02-10-15, 02:41 PM
You know shit about Europe. you know shit about me, you know shit about warzone douche bag living in safe country like Canada.

I had my great grandfather killed by UPA, therefore I will hate Ukrainians with passion, forever. I know what UPA and Bandera guys did to Poles in WW2. No, they are not saints media tell us to believe in.

Yes, Syria is in this situation because, the people, wanted it to be like that. Don't believe me? How many Syrians you know? None, I thought so.

I know few in Poland and trust me, NONE of the scum coming through borders is hurt. They flee for SOCIAL life and NO work. Come on, if you had choice to live and get paid for it, why not take it? Plus I command your naive thought, must be USA thing.

I wonder how many of those "refugees" are really war refugees (I doubt it will be 50% of the people) and how many are actually "stealth" ISIS forces (actually captured, yes, on Hungarian border).

Seriously, who is living under the rock here? Canadians should shut the fuck up about European affairs. You have NO CLUE about what is going on here, you live on propagandous media crap.

Ask people in respective countries if they want to even take the refugees in, you would be surprised to hear the answer from most people...

As for blaming Hungarians, read about Ottoman empire. They had that shit for many years, so no wonder, they are not willing to accept this shit on their ground yet again.

Also I recommend seeing what's happening in Luton/Leicester in UK.

I know you hate me, but really, fuck off me mate. Live in your country in peace. you're like 4000km away from here, so don't tell us what to do. PLEASE.

Ah and yes, for your information, most of those Hungarians you badmouth from 1950s actually WORKED. Not lived on social that government provides.

Janis89
02-10-15, 06:03 PM
They come here only because of guaranteed social life (Germans pay HUGE chunk of money). You think they will go to work? LOL. - Dont have the numbers in my head. But iirc about 50-60% syrians and the rest afhan, paki eritrea etc...



Also show me proof there are KIDS and WOMEN coming here. Rarely saw that. Only see young men, who should be fighting for their COUNTRY, but instead they flee. Bunch of pussies! - Denmarks stats - 72% men.......


Shoot them down. The problem would be solved. Accepting that shit into Europe will bring disaster in long run. Can't wait to see terrorist attacks in major cities and then EU governing body to panic about ISIS... Look at Brussels (right now, most dangerous European country due to... islam/muslims). - Had they been refugees and not gold diggers, they would have been happy to stay in the first safe country with food and shelter... they wanna go Norway, Sweden and Germany.. They throw away money for thousands of Euros because it is from the red CROSS. They rape and force women into prostitution.

and they come here to get a straw into our financial welfare system. and they take their fucked up culture with them.

It`s sad for the ones that acutally are refugees and need our help :(


Sweden says welcome here since the 90s. Sweden is now the rape capital of Europe.

But this is censored by the mass media. You have to live here to see it.

People are too scared to be called racists to stand up for their country.


Edit : Craig you ahve no idea..... Please read something else than the god damn mass media. we are allowed to make our own opinion. Just because something is written in the media every day, does not make it true for that reason... Be a little critical

info0
02-10-15, 06:15 PM
:hail: thank God I am not the only one.

Craig Forrest
02-10-15, 06:21 PM
A) I don't believe what I read. I actually have a brain, listen to experts, and don't just accept whatever the media is trying to spoon feed me. I'm very critical. I'm also intolerant of the current anti-Muslim, anti-Arab, anti-foreigner sentiment that is spreading across once tolerant countries.... 50 years ago it was the blacks, now it's the Muslims and Arabs.... wonder what it will be next....



http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c6/Rape_rate_per_100%2C000_-_country_comparison_-_United_Nations_2012.png
This is probably the favorite chart of any anti-immigration activist on the internet. It clearly shows that, as a result of Sweden's liberal immigration policy and overly humane refugee acceptance, the country has now become a hellscape where blue-eyed women are raped daily by Muslims and blacks. As much so that now there are more per capita rapes in Sweden than in Bolivia.

There are two major problems with these statistics.

I. "In Sweden there has been this ambition explicitly to record every case of sexual violence separately, to make it visible in the statistics," according to Klara Selin, a sociologist at the National Council for Crime Prevention in Stockholm. "So, for instance, when a woman comes to the police and she says my husband or my fiance raped me almost every day during the last year, the police have to record each of these events, which might be more than 300 events. In many other countries it would just be one record - one victim, one type of crime, one record."
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-19592372

This technical note renders this whole comparison meaningless, but let's go further, because the second point is more interesting.

II. As everyone who has ever studied criminology knows, in the case of rape, there is insane latency rates. If there is willingness to report rape, the number will skyrocket in any country. In countries where rape remains associated with a strong taboo and a high level of shame, the propensity to report such offences probably tends to be lower than in countries characterized by a higher level of sexual equality. The findings of the 2000 International Crime Victims Survey indicate that the respondents' satisfaction with the police is above average in Sweden. Sweden has also been ranked number one in sexual equality.

In addition, there is also the issue of the broad legal definition of rape in Sweden.

If you are going to assess how much of a hellscape Sweden has become as a result of immigration based on a single piece of statistical data, I advise using another violent crime where latency is significantly lower; just to be one step closer to the truth, if that matters at all. There is the murder rate, for example:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate#/media/File:Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate.svg

info0
02-10-15, 06:35 PM
Sorry mate, but you won't make Europeans and Christians tolerate islam. Like I said, you have no clue about why people hate them here and trust me it's not racism. They brought it on themselves and how do they treat Christians in their OWN country.

Plus they DO NOT ASSIMILATE with other CULTURES that's what I know FOR A FACT. Living here. Being to Germany. They create their own society pretty much like Jews do.

No matter if they are educated their religion teachings stay deep within them. Would gladly make you talk to my Dad about Arabs. He knew few of them and one was a doctor at University of Warsaw. This didn't stop him from cutting my Dad's friend hand because, he, put his arms around his Egyptian female friend (mind you, all of them were under alcohol).

How can you excuse such behavior? No-one should behave like that. Ever.

As for black people, I believe this is the race with highest criminal rate of all (even here in Netherlands it is true). Please don't tell me it's due to racism, cause that's not the case.

Janis89
02-10-15, 06:52 PM
A) I don't believe what I read. I actually have a brain, listen to experts, and don't just accept whatever the media is trying to spoon feed me. I'm very critical. I'm also intolerant of the current anti-Muslim, anti-Arab, anti-foreigner sentiment that is spreading across once tolerant countries.... 50 years ago it was the blacks, now it's the Muslims and Arabs.... wonder what it will be next....

I got some friends over now. So will ahve to get back to you on that.

No matter how they record anything... Fact is that the big majority of rapes are done by foreigners from certain cultures.

Craig Forrest
02-10-15, 07:03 PM
Sure. Find me some reputable citation that doesn't come from an anti-immigrant, anti-Muslim site and I'll believe it.... but if it's from infowars or globalresearch or some crap like that then don't bother.

Swedish crime statistics showing the ethnicity of the perpetrator would be good.... or even the victim's nationality.... I know that in over 90% of rape cases, the victim and the attacker know each other and in many cases are friends and/or relatives (or married or in a relationship).

Janis89
02-10-15, 07:18 PM
Sure. Find me some reputable citation that doesn't come from an anti-immigrant, anti-Muslim site and I'll believe it.... but if it's from infowars or globalresearch or some crap like that then don't bother.

Swedish crime statistics showing the ethnicity of the perpetrator would be good.... or even the victim's nationality.... I know that in over 90% of rape cases, the victim and the attacker know each other and in many cases are friends and/or relatives (or married or in a relationship).

Oh really?

Craig Forrest
02-10-15, 07:23 PM
Yes. Before I worked in Firearms, I worked in an area of the RCMP that deals with rape and sexual crimes. Part of my job was researching the associated trends and the criminology aspects of sexual crimes from around the world... and statistics constantly show that 80 - 90 % of rapes and over 75% of sexual assaults are committed by someone that the victims knows.... and in most cases it's a friend, colleague, partner, family member, etc....

Janis89
02-10-15, 07:45 PM
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5195/sweden-rape

It`s hard to find articles in English. Can link you a couple of hundred Swedish\Norwegian ones

Swedish media censors where the rapist is from (if the rapist is foreign ony though) Not that bad here though, yet. But they are following in the Swedish footsteps. Good luck

there is no way out from the fact that our cultures are completely different and well they dont uhm integrate well..... But dont say it loud, you are a racists or anti something. We must be politically correct and all that nonsense. I say let`s be honest and cut the bullshit.

I am just watching in horror what is happening in Europe and Scandinavia. The only issue that gets brought up involving immigrants is the financial one. they dont dare to take up all the other issues - drugs - ghettos - prostitusjon - rape - robbings - in fear of the racist stamp. Non western immigrants costs Norway 4,5 million per head.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiXXFtd-SJ8

Yes they look like they are in real need of food, shelter and safety. Throwing the food and water away, why you might wonder?.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiXXFtd-SJ8

Janis89
02-10-15, 07:50 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thXCb1VUBDg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUBhvmUEcqw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCGedOGCrnQ

Janis89
02-10-15, 08:07 PM
Take it as you like. Youtube might not be the most credible source.

But this is the reality of how it has become\is becoming.

It is out of control and the Swedes dont know what to do. Too late to turn back.

It`s no coincidence that the Sweden Democrats now are the biggest in Sweden - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden_Democrats

Danish Peoples Party just had their biggest election ever, coincidence? - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danish_People%27s_Party

Craig Forrest
02-10-15, 08:37 PM
Yup. Nationalist parties tend to rise up when they can pin the country's problems on "outsiders" rather than face the actual causes..... and nothing bad ever comes from that

Deutschland den Deutschen

http://ukrmap.su/program2009/wh10/9/30.jpg

info0
02-10-15, 09:22 PM
I bet Hitler rolls in his grave seeing in what state is Germany right now (and I can't blame him for wanting clear race either :P)

Janis89
02-10-15, 09:41 PM
http://www.hngn.com/articles/134765/20150929/facebook-ceo-mark-zuckerberg-admits-plans-to-censor-anti-migrant-posts.htm

Talking about mass media being censored.........


http://www.cnbc.com/2015/09/27/angela-merkel-caught-on-hot-mic-pressing-facebook-ceo-over-anti-immigrant-posts.html

Yet any action from Facebook is likely to stoke concerns about free speech. In the past, the social network has come under suspicion for suppressing or deleting posts and groups that advocate unpopular beliefs.


It`s all about being politically correct and being seen and heard, and to get likes or praise nowadays. Opinions? what are those. I`ll go with whatever is popular and gets me the most praise sociallly...

Be postitive and have tunnelvision :ok:

djole2mcloud
03-10-15, 07:21 PM
there are thousands of refugees here in seriba every day...they don't do anything wrong,but still...something isn't that right
there is so many young lads,loaded with money...only in one day one post office near Belgrade rail station received half of million euros via Western Union addresed all to
this very same refugees...they spend their time in the evening at restaurants,pubs and other expensive places...
also,minoroty of them are actually from Syria,other come mostly from Afghanistan and Iraq...



also,why are they doing this in hungary when they giving them food and water

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0IWdu97LXY

on the other hand i can understand why hungarians,croatians and other closing their borders...different religion,suspicious people,different diseases...
something isn't quite right...