Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 26 to 50 of 54

Thread: Training - New Position

  1. #26
    Join Date
    18-05-13
    Posts
    811
    vCash
    2500
    kraft to MC? what's the thinking behind that?

  2. #27
    Join Date
    09-03-12
    Location
    London
    Posts
    864
    vCash
    2400
    I've been trying to do this for years as part of my "turning water into wine" obsession and find it incredibly frustrating that you can't retrain the vast majority of players. Really, it should be down to playing attributes and versatility. For instance, if I have a right midfielder with great positioning and tackling, I should be able to turn him into a right back. However, in my view, it's solely down to the way positions work. I took these screengrabs from CM Agent:



    So, Casey Schmidt is some scrub in the OTL benchmark, Kieron Dyer is one of the best midfielders in the ODB. Schmidt can only play DMC or MC. His zeroes mean he can't be trained into anything else, eventhough he might be a little more successful as a striker. Dyer could conceivably be trained as anything because he has at least a 1 in everything. However, more obviously, with some training, he could play on the left. It won't stick, something which annoys me immensely (and something I either put in or should have put in as a patch request for Tapani), but it's down to the positional matrix more than anything.

  3. #28
    Join Date
    18-05-13
    Posts
    811
    vCash
    2500
    i'm actually ok with this. one thing that i believe is a constant problem in real football, is manager playing players out of position. right wingers on the left. DC at RB. forwards on the wing. many players have one position that they play their best in, even though they may play the majority of their career in another position.

    two examples:
    emile heskey
    his goal record at liverpool does not look good. yet, he scored a total of 60 goals in 220. the criticism he gets for his time as a striker is kinda legendary. but he played pretty much 50 of his time as a left winger because "he could do a job there". but really he couldn't. he couldn't beat RB with skill. his left foot was weaker than his righting so if he ever simply out paced the RB, the cross would suck. he was a striker who teams tried to retrain as a left winger. he played there but he didn't like it or play well.

    kieron dyer
    he was a good M C who would often get played out wide on the right because he was damn fast. he seemed fine with this because he was right footed. he had good games there. but whenever someone tried playing him on the left, his ability was completely curbed. it didn't matter how many teams/managers/coaches tried, he was never really capable of playing on the left.

    the game, apparently, does a good job of not letting players get too versatile.

  4. #29
    Join Date
    09-03-12
    Location
    London
    Posts
    864
    vCash
    2400
    I think you could also argue it doesn't let them become versatile enough. Most players have had to remake themselves in another position to get a career in the game. However, you can't do it AT ALL in CM, if the positional numbers aren't there. Kevin Horlock was versatile, left West Ham having been an ineffective left back through his youth career but through determination, versatility and good coaching, he remade himself as a defensive midfielder. You can't do that in CM because the thought process wasn't there in the design. In my view, it's a part of the game which is under-developed.

  5. #30
    Join Date
    18-12-11
    Location
    On the oche
    Posts
    2,897
    vCash
    10736
    Quote Originally Posted by ajra21 View Post
    kraft to MC? what's the thinking behind that?
    I'm pissing about with a centralized tactic atm and his physical atts are too good to punt him/go to waste Doing not bad atm:



    Every game he's played has been on the right of a central midfield trio. His hidden atts are 12 for centre and 10 for midfield so he has a bit in that area at game start

  6. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Goofy For This Useful Post:


  7. #31
    Join Date
    18-05-13
    Posts
    811
    vCash
    2500
    fair enough. i've thought about training him to be a D/M R so i can occasionally play him in midfield but as i play a narrow midfield, i figured it would be pointless. but if he can hold down a D/M RC, then i might consider it.

    that said, i still think finding good FB are one of the hardest things to do, so keeping him as my long term #2 is the best bet.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by faz44 View Post
    I think you could also argue it doesn't let them become versatile enough. Most players have had to remake themselves in another position to get a career in the game. However, you can't do it AT ALL in CM, if the positional numbers aren't there. Kevin Horlock was versatile, left West Ham having been an ineffective left back through his youth career but through determination, versatility and good coaching, he remade himself as a defensive midfielder. You can't do that in CM because the thought process wasn't there in the design. In my view, it's a part of the game which is under-developed.
    fair enough.

    the game is never going to be perfect.

  8. #32
    Join Date
    23-04-13
    Posts
    35
    vCash
    500

    New position training question

    Hello guys.

    How effective it is? I've read many people saying that it doesnt work as it should.

    I have a DM and i want to train him to be a CD, but it's been 1 year and he didn't learn that position yet. Does it help if he always plays in that new position?

  9. #33
    Join Date
    05-03-12
    Posts
    304
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by hollaplaya View Post
    Hello guys.

    How effective it is? I've read many people saying that it doesnt work as it should.

    I have a DM and i want to train him to be a CD, but it's been 1 year and he didn't learn that position yet. Does it help if he always plays in that new position?
    It's very effective and shouldn't take much longer than a year... playing time in the position is important to speed up the process.

  10. #34
    Join Date
    23-04-13
    Posts
    35
    vCash
    500
    Thank you Jack!

    And thanks moderation to change the topic to this thread.

  11. #35
    Join Date
    12-03-12
    Posts
    91
    vCash
    500
    You can train new positions?

  12. #36
    Join Date
    16-12-11
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    12,024
    vCash
    1739
    Im not sure everyone has the ability to train new position though, has something to do with the adaptability attribute or something similar!

  13. #37
    Join Date
    12-03-12
    Posts
    91
    vCash
    500
    Had a rake about and found out where in the training section it is. For some reason I didn't think it was available in this version of the game. May try it out.

  14. #38
    Join Date
    02-03-12
    Location
    Here
    Posts
    3,281
    vCash
    636613
    Quote Originally Posted by Dermotron View Post
    Having a leaf through the original manual earlier -

    Versatility:

    Physical: N/A
    Mental: The ability of the player to be able to change from his regular position to unfamiliar ones. Players with a high value will be more receptive to positional changes in training
    Essential Ability for: Any player that you wish to change the position of, such as utility players.
    What to look for: N/A

    And profesionalism as Dermotron mentioned. Professionalism keeps the player from complaining about the new training

  15. #39
    Join Date
    03-03-12
    Posts
    2,580
    vCash
    5200
    I have no problems retraining players but if I move them back off the programme they tend to lose the position, how long do you need to leave them after they have the new position?

  16. #40
    Join Date
    16-06-14
    Posts
    129
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by Cam F View Post
    I have no problems retraining players but if I move them back off the programme they tend to lose the position, how long do you need to leave them after they have the new position?
    I read somewhere that after they've learnt their new position they need to keep training the new position until the game updates (either Dec update or June update I think). Then it should stick...

  17. #41
    Join Date
    10-05-16
    Location
    On the Bench
    Posts
    151
    vCash
    700
    I recently bought Morgan Sanson, an AMC, and tried to Train him as AMRLC (why ? I have no idea )

    The Thing is, once he got pissed of with this Training, i tokk him back to the others midfielders and saw after a while he became an DMC... so i looked in the Editor. The Player had new: DMid. 15 Mid. 1 ( ) AMid. 14.

    The Thing is, I changed it back to Mid: 20 but it keeps changing it back now all the times after a few days to DMC...

  18. #42
    Join Date
    02-03-12
    Posts
    4,554
    vCash
    1
    Anything with 15 or above for DM will show as DM, no matter how high a stat they have for M or AM.

  19. #43
    Join Date
    16-06-14
    Posts
    129
    vCash
    500
    So one thing I've worked out with new positions... if a player learns a new position relatively quickly, he will take longer to lose that position when going back to normal training, sometimes as much as 3 months. Whereas a player that takes for ever to learn a new position, will lose it quickly, maybe within a week. (Assuming player starts off with a value of 1 for that position, instead of something like 14)

    I'm pretty sure this is all to do with the adaptability attribute, if it's small the player will also lose the new position training he learnt faster. Other mental attributes that are poor that make them bitch and moan about the training, don't seem to have an effect on how quickly they gain or lose new position training.

    I've got many players in new position training, I'll see what happens when the game updates in June and see if any new positions learnt will be permanent.

  20. #44
    Join Date
    19-04-15
    Location
    here's not here
    Posts
    61
    vCash
    500
    I find that young players tend to learn new positions/sides faster. Most of them usually pick up the new roles in less than a year even if they are unhappy.

    I played MVV recently and trained 2 young twins in new positions which remained permanent. 1 of them was from AML to AMLC and the other was from DRC to D/DMRC. I sold the AMLC after the 1st season and I left MVV after 3-4 seasons.

    I remember checking back after about 10 seasons and both players still have their trained positions.

  21. #45
    Join Date
    21-06-14
    Posts
    115
    vCash
    500
    I'm actually forcing some bhutani players to learn a new position (for the sake of putting them in a role which should suit them better and because I have no AMC in the whole country).

    My first subject, who was 29 when it started, waited more than one year before agreeing to play in the center. And after two years of painful whipping, he's still not entirely ready to play AMC (this position appears and disappears weekly).

    The second is younger, being only 25 when the brainwashing debuted. It took one whole year before the new position started to appear next to his name. It's not over, I need to train him longer.

    Of course, the two of them are hating me since I gave them their new orders. When you think that they have to cope with me when playing for the club and the national team... I'm not very popular.

  22. #46
    Join Date
    19-04-15
    Location
    here's not here
    Posts
    61
    vCash
    500
    Going slightly off-topic with this post:
    I once made a player lose a position by training him in a position he supposedly knows. He was a AM/FRL and by comparing him with a GK, he could play in mid, attacking mid, winger and striker. I put him in a training schedule where the new position is midfield. He became unhappy with the training, lost the midfield ratings and became a FRL.

  23. #47
    Join Date
    16-06-14
    Posts
    129
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by drown View Post
    I find that young players tend to learn new positions/sides faster. Most of them usually pick up the new roles in less than a year even if they are unhappy.

    I played MVV recently and trained 2 young twins in new positions which remained permanent. 1 of them was from AML to AMLC and the other was from DRC to D/DMRC. I sold the AMLC after the 1st season and I left MVV after 3-4 seasons.

    I remember checking back after about 10 seasons and both players still have their trained positions.
    That's interesting, that's the first time I've read anywhere that players can be trained in positions permanently. Can you remember if they were learning new position when the game updated in June or December? And did they have a high adaptability attribute?

  24. #48
    Join Date
    19-04-15
    Location
    here's not here
    Posts
    61
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by Whyme View Post
    That's interesting, that's the first time I've read anywhere that players can be trained in positions permanently. Can you remember if they were learning new position when the game updated in June or December? And did they have a high adaptability attribute?
    They were definitely still on the position training schedules during the game updates. I don't know about the adaptability attribute as I am not using an editor but both players should be high since they were never unhappy about it.

    I just recalled another player whom I trained from AMLRC to FLRC and this guy was unhappy about training when I sold him to WBA. Funny thing was few years later, he was still unhappy about training but retained his FLRC trained position. Seems like a bug to me.

  25. #49
    Join Date
    19-04-15
    Location
    here's not here
    Posts
    61
    vCash
    500
    This is the player I sold to WBA when I was still at Sporting Gijon, think he was 16 or 17 at that time. Seems like he learnt the position permanently.
    Spoiler!


    I remember he was still unhappy about training at WBA, guess he got other problems to deal with now.
    Spoiler!

  26. #50
    Join Date
    16-06-14
    Posts
    129
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by drown View Post
    They were definitely still on the position training schedules during the game updates. I don't know about the adaptability attribute as I am not using an editor but both players should be high since they were never unhappy about it.

    I just recalled another player whom I trained from AMLRC to FLRC and this guy was unhappy about training when I sold him to WBA. Funny thing was few years later, he was still unhappy about training but retained his FLRC trained position. Seems like a bug to me.
    That Caamano lad seems to have a few issues, maybe he's got some wacky mental attributes that enable him to keep his new pos! As you say tho it's more likely a bug - maybe they always keep their new position when sold to a new club? Will keep an eye on that one too.

    My game isn't far off the game update, so I'll put lots of players on new training beforehand to see if they keep their new position afterwards. Tho I'm managing 12 teams so it could take a while to get to the update still!

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •