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Thread: CM 01/02: 10 years of work and editing

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by midnight toker View Post


    This is like a dream come true! I'v been waiting for something like this for years now!
    Thank you so much for your hard work. Time for nostalgia fix!
    Today's players and football are so boring, this will truly bring back the legendary feeling of 01/02 season!

    p.s. Just one question, can I use tapani patch 2.21.1 with this data?
    I'm delighted to hear that ! and I could't agree more on your point that the 01/02 season was far more interesting than today's football. To me it represents the transition of an old era into a new.
    Enjoy my work and if you have any remarks feel free to share them.

    No idea regarding your question about the tapani patch though. I have never used that patch myself as I've always stuck to my own database. I'm sure that most other members here will be able to guide you on that quickly enough.

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  3. #27
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    Amazing work. Are you mad IRL? Lol.

  4. #28
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    He is a madman or a god. Probably both! 😁

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  6. #29
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    Amazing work, it's due to the dedication and slight craziness that this game continues to go from strength to strength. Long may it continue👏👏👏👏

    Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

  7. #30
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    Hi Luessenhoff,
    There are some missing players from original database such a Skalidis, Doukas, Freyr, etc.
    Also there are some clubs missing . You delete them to match real life?

  8. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by xeno View Post
    Hi Luessenhoff,
    There are some missing players from original database such a Skalidis, Doukas, Freyr, etc.
    Also there are some clubs missing . You delete them to match real life?
    These guys are not present in the ODB .60, they didn't appear until .68 data which is essentially an 02/03 update.

  9. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by xeno View Post
    Hi Luessenhoff,
    There are some missing players from original database such a Skalidis, Doukas, Freyr, etc.
    Also there are some clubs missing . You delete them to match real life?
    Hi Xeno
    No I have not deleted these players because they simply weren’t there. I have never had another database than the original one but through reading I found out about the so called .68 database with superstars such as Skalidis. But MrBuckminster already answered your question. I have not deleted any clubs either. It could well be though that some of the clubs that you were looking for have been renamed. By renaming I do not mean changing their name / making other clubs out of them, but completing the name to make them easier to find. This does not apply to any club in the leagues that can be selected but e.g. to obscure clubs in Africa that had incorrect / incomplete names. Anyhow such completions are very limited in numbers and it’s still something I would like to do in the future.

    By the way: During most of the past ten years the focus was on the players only (position, DOB, nationality, attributes, caps, …,) . More recently though, a few months before making this thread, the total absence of certain clubs started annoying me because this meant some smaller nations did not have any players at all. In some nations’ cases some of the players were in the database but without a club and you CM01-02 rats now what that implies … no club = not getting called up … no matter how great the player is and even if the country does not have any other players to rely upon! I needed to solve this so for example I created most of the important clubs of Suriname and Haiti, to name two.

    If I stumble upon a certain player and I’m having my doubts about the correctness of his position I will start consulting and doing research like a madman.
    I went to great lengths to make sure that players’ positions are correctly inputted. Enter Bayern forward Paulo Sergio. As far as I can remember, in all the versions I played (CM3, 99-00, up to 01-02 and 02-03) , he has been portrayed as centre-right forward. Various sources claimed otherwise … but not all sources are reliable either, so I finally stumbled upon a German interview in which he specifically said that his natural and favorite position is on the left wing. Personally I do not think wrong information lies at the basis of these mistakes but simply “input errors”: if you have to input many ten thousands of players like the game producers of CM do I’m sure some errors will happen sooner or later. A tiny difference in the editor can have a huge impact in-game though!

    Not all changes occur in a planned fashion. Sometimes I’m just roaming about in the editor and if I see an incomplete date of birth, my reflex is to hit the google button. In doing so I’ve corrected many thousands of staff but evidently, in a database of over 133000 items, it doesn’t immediately show.
    Since the last update posted here, I have been working even harder. Due to illness (nothing serious) I was unable to do sports so I invested all of my spare into my CM project. Nearly 50 (!) working hours have passed, at times sighing and cursing and many more will be passing no doubt. Once again, impossible to list every change individually, I’ve got my hands full with editing alone ! The list hereunder gives you an idea: the three first points have been the most time-consuming ones.

    *Middle American nations (excluding Mexico) scrutinized. Example par excellence: Honduras now has a main squad of which 75% (rough estimate) has fixed attributes. It used to be the opposite. There was way too much randomness in most of those players. At the very least, the countries’ leading players should have fixed attributes for more realism and less randomness. Fixed attributes, correct position and caps have been my main concern, I don’t care about career stats / club history too much simply because for those nations they are generally very hard to come bu. If they could be readily retrieved I added them. Caps were mostly okay already as I had already done ferocious work on that in the past. +- 10 missing players created. Other nations greatly affected by this update include Panama, El Salvador, Nicaragua and tiny Belize (the latter from I think 0 players in the ODB to +- 7-8 now). I’m very happy with the result. Example: Thanks to the fixed attributes, Honduras now is a local powerhouse, not because of great players but because they can rely on a basis of solid players that aren’t great. (In the ODB basically they only had Caballero (Udinese) as a beast and the rest was mostly random, even star striker Carlos Pavon (Udinese)

    *South-American nations (excluding Brazil , Argentina, Guyana, Suriname): rough estimate: +- 20 players per nation have been provided with fixed attributes. Understandably, the randomness in the continent’s weaker nations Bolivia and Venezuela was omnipresent, but also Ecuador, Paraguay, Chile, Colombia Peru and even, but to a much lesser extent , Uruguay still had established players without fixed attributes: all now have more leading players with fixed attributes in their main squads and some also now benefit from some more youth players . Of course all the positions have been investigated as well. Basically you can say that most of the continent’s internationals that were active between 1998 and 2003 have been checked.

    *The African nations that had been very poorly done in the ODB have been further improved. This applies mainly to: Angola, Burkina Faso, Mali, Gabon, Guinea, Mauritania, Rwanda, ... (Giving more players fixed attributes, added some missing players, linked players to the correct club if necessary etc etc …). I had already done tonnes of input in the past, but in many cases without providing them with fixed attributes. Egypt was one of the more carefully done nations in the ODB, but its most important players were still very much random. Much has been completed and improved. The squad selections now reflect reality more than before.

    *Cyprus was also very incomplete. Even after my work there are still some players missing, but most of the national squad is now complete, which means they can finally pick between some mediocre defenders rather than having to select players whose CA-PA and attributes were a plain “0”.

    *Completed some players’ attributes spread all over the world (Belgium, Russia, Turkey, Italy, Kazakhstan, Netherlands, Latvia, Switzerland… and many more)  noteworthy: Emile Mpenza is a total beast in the ODB that can compete with the likes of most top strikers. Yes, he was by all means a talented player but got massively overrated, especially his work rate was anything but ferocious and his professionalism highly debatable. He was reputed to spend his time nailing chicks more than working hard to improve himself as a footballer. In fact he lost much of his credit at Schalke during that very 01/02 season. His attributes have thus been downgraded. He’s still a very nice player to have (fast, explosive and gifted) and the best Belgian striker of his generation.

    *Bahrain had 0 internationals, now they have 3. (It’s a start but of course Bahrain is not a priority, lol)

    *Attributed correct number of caps – goals to Vietnam’s all-time top goalscorer. This had somehow eluded me.

    *Stumbled upon a double player, he got disposed of.

    *Added some career stats here and there (the Spanish league was well-detailed in the ODB, but the second division could do with a little more player history. It’s far from complete but it has been considerably improved)

    *Tonnes and tonnes of insignificant changes and completions that constitute a tiny but genuine contribution to a more complete database.

    Will continue my work over the next couple of weeks and will post it here as usual.

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  11. #33
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    Luessenhoff, I have to take my hat off to you. This kind of dedication is simply awe inspiring. To delve into the detail you do is mind blowing. Consider yourself a legend of Championship Manager😊

    Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

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  13. #34
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    I really love this update.

    I like how players like Ribery, Drogba, Yaya Toure, Kolo Toure and Essien are all present in the version and look very promising.

    Amazing work!

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  15. #35
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    Amazing work!Thank you for your hard work!

  16. #36
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    Lazyjay, MrBuckminster and Xiaonan: thanks for your words of appreciation. Doing it all for myself to improve the game experience is one thing, but sharing the fruit of my work with others that appreciate it makes it even more worthwhile to me.

    A limited overview of the changes have already been announced in my previous post.
    I finally managed to solve a mystery which had been puzzling me for many months. The Armenians would always call up a defender playing in the Greek lower league with only the surname "Kortsarian" (or Kourtsarian?), no exact DOB, born in 1968 according to the database. No info could be found on him so there had to be something wrong. Turns out my suspicions were justified. The actual player was a remnant of an Armenian striker (not defender) who played there back in 1999 (not anymore in 2001). So, position, DOB, club contract and name were all wrong. Good riddance

    Link to the newest update: http://www18.zippyshare.com/v/KvqCcvzr/file.html
    Last edited by Luessenhoff; 11-10-16 at 09:39 PM.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by midnight toker View Post


    This is like a dream come true! I'v been waiting for something like this for years now!
    Thank you so much for your hard work. Time for nostalgia fix!
    Today's players and football are so boring, this will truly bring back the legendary feeling of 01/02 season!

    p.s. Just one question, can I use tapani patch 2.21.1 with this data?

    It seems so, works for me.

    Luessenhoff you're a hero/legend. Retro 01/02 with the new interface and Tapani patch (at least for the coloured attributes) this will tide me over until the October update, bloody marvellous work.

  18. #38
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    Fantastic thing Luessenhoff congrats about this it is unbeliveable.

    Just one thing I noticed is Ronaldinho current ability in editor is on 16 and I think you wanted to put it 160, or maybe it is just something in my editor.

  19. #39
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    Do I validate the data when I open it in editor? I wanted to edit some things in database and it asked me to validate. When I confirmed it reported numerous inconsistencies. Oh btw legendary Javier Zanetti is not right midfielder, but right fullback, an old mistake in original data. Also Zambrotta, most of his career played as left fullback. There are more things like this, you didnt know, or didt want to edit details like this?

  20. #40
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    As for Ronaldinho, damn Asemprion you're right ... I'm baffled because I didn't touch him. CA should be 164 ! Some kind error must have led to this.

    As for Zanetti, indeed, his dominant position should be right back. I will fix this immediately. (Zanetti was also untouched)
    @ midnight toker: odd performances time after time again is what prompts me into editing. Zanetti always performs as a right defender in spite of his data in the editor. So that way I overlooked him. I must have also assumed that such a well-known player must have been well done. Thanks for the tip !

    With regard to Zambrotta: he was edited a long time ago (I increased his capability as 'defender', I believe from something like 8 to 13) and in my eyes it's a bit more complicated than the way you put it. He may have played as a left back for a big part of his career, but he started it as a midfielder. If you look up the details of the 2003 CL final, you will see he played as a left midfielder. Don't be deceived too much by his low 'defender' rating cause this is at least partly countered by the 'wingback' field.

    If there is something I've learned after so many years of working with the editor, it is that it isn't all attributes and CA-PA. Sometimes, players that seem overrated attributes-wise are demoted by positional attributes or vice versa. It's all about balance and it's the balance that explains why some players with relatively mediocre or even downright poor attributes perform so well.

    http://www77.zippyshare.com/v/AdOUr3dC/file.html
    Last edited by Luessenhoff; 15-10-16 at 11:50 AM.

  21. #41
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    this sounds great!! - but it says a virus has been detected, and my computer has blocked the download, am i clicking on a wrong link lol?

  22. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyforber View Post
    this sounds great!! - but it says a virus has been detected, and my computer has blocked the download, am i clicking on a wrong link lol?
    Here too. Don't pay it any mind, I've just scanned my file to be sure and "no threats" have been detected.

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  24. #43
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    great workt dude,

    There is a way to join two databases like in football manager editor??

  25. #44
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    Join two databases? Don't know what that means bro, I don't play any managers other than 01/02.

  26. #45
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    Just started playing this Database and loving it. Awesome work Luessenhoff and thank you for sharing it!.

  27. #46
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    Hey L. tnx for your reply. What about data validation after opening it in editor? To do or not to do? And keep up the good work.

  28. #47
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    Data validation? I have no clue ...

    New update: +- 30 players edited (including history gaps filled in) primarily players of Serie A and B and Norwegians, and Zambrotta has been edited to good effect ! Dominant position still midfielder at this point in his career but will perform much better as a defender.

    http://www27.zippyshare.com/v/Xw2EJJCi/file.html

    Changes:

    Sheffield United player Gysbrechts: incomplete history filled in.
    Cyril Rool was incorrectly contracted to Marseille, he was full property of Lens, being consecutively loaned to Marseille and Monaco
    Zambrotta as listed above
    A couple of dozens of players, mostly youngsters in the Italian leagues, have been given fixed attributes.

    I am aware there's still the highly overrated player ROSSINI (Atalanta). I might work on that in the next update, but I'm always hesitant about making radical changes. I strive for realism, so I do take into account his performances during his real-life career but on the other hand the fact that he had the reputation of being a promising player at that time should be retained just as well. Inputting complete player histories sounds time-consuming, but in fact the most time-consuming part is the testing after having edited players, and re-editing and testing over and over again. Once upon a time I literally spent months trying to make AS ROMA prefer Antonioli over Pellizoli (Antonioli was the undisputed starter but he doesn't stand a chance against Pellizoli in the original database). The very obvious approaches (increasing and decreasing abilities, reputations and attributes) didn't work at all. I do not even remember how I managed to solve it, all I know is I did solve it while at the same time remaining quite loyal to their original attributes. As I've said before: it shows that the game mechanics seem to prefer balance over individual numbers, though the latter is of course an essential part.

    Fine-tuning youngsters that eventually evolved into class players is another tricky thing. You've got to give them the potential while at the same time you've got to make sure they won't immediately outclass the established first team players.
    Last edited by Luessenhoff; 18-10-16 at 09:33 AM.

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  30. #48
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    You are using original editor right? When you open the data in editor, I think for the first time, it asks you to validate the database for consistency. When I did this for your data it reported lots of errors, with histories and similar. I am sure other experienced this also.

  31. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by midnight toker View Post
    You are using original editor right? When you open the data in editor, I think for the first time, it asks you to validate the database for consistency. When I did this for your data it reported lots of errors, with histories and similar. I am sure other experienced this also.
    Yes it's the Original editor that comes with the game itself if I remember correctly.
    I've never seen any "validation" though. Could you perhaps upload a screenshot of such an error report?
    And are any others having this problem? I would think that if that were the case, someone would have reported it sooner?

  32. #50
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    Thank you for your work. I am getting back into CM 01/02 and I love this database!

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