PDA

View Full Version : Harder AI Tactics



barney
11-04-12, 02:15 PM
ok so on tapanis cm0102 patcher v2.18.1 and 2.19 there is a ENABLE HARDER AL TACTICS but you cant tick box does any body no how i can tick the box in both patches????

Fods
11-04-12, 02:15 PM
U cant on the 2.** versions, only the 3.** version. (I think)

Unique-89
18-12-12, 10:56 PM
thanks but that is the old version yes? and was there a file for harder ai tactics?

Dermotron
18-12-12, 11:20 PM
There's only ever been one idb.

Harder AI tactics is only usable when playing a 3.12 Tapanified Database.

FAM0422
26-10-14, 01:25 AM
Dear Managers,
Could you please advise tactic i can use which is realistic in terms of results. For example i have used iodine CF etc and even with poor side can easily get gd results and challenge for stuff and beat much better teams with better player's then my team.. i have try other tactic and it to easy... Messi Scored 100 goalsfgoals in a seasoind game to easy i seen in download section there is harder ai file.. What tactic do i use against this to make iit more realistic.. Pls advise.
I just use data updates no custom patches.

Dermotron
26-10-14, 01:07 PM
Just don't use iodine.

Make your own tactic and use that..


The Harder AI Tactics pack in the download section will require you to use something like iodine to beat it thought

nexima
30-10-14, 10:17 PM
guys... we need something in the middle... regular tactics too easy while playing with harder AI tactics is too difficult...

may i see who agrees?

faz44
31-10-14, 09:49 PM
Didn't one of the Tapani patches add harder AI tactics? Does it use them?

nexima
02-11-14, 09:12 PM
read my message again more carefully...

faz44
02-11-14, 09:42 PM
I read your post perfectly. The harder AI tactics in the Downloads section are different from the ones in the Tapani harder tactics patch.

nexima
03-11-14, 12:00 PM
Alright, now clear.. thanks for sharing... i will try it for sure in this case.. :ok:

samsami
16-11-14, 06:51 PM
It seems to me that if you use the standard AI tactics you have two options:
1) Play without using WibWob so the game remains (too) challenging
2) Use WibWob and be (too) successful
You can always switch back and forth of course.

Now if you use the Harder AI Tactics, you HAVE to use WibWob or you're dead.
Of course you can then design your own WibWob tactic or download & use the most effective one around.

Is that correct? Or am I missing something?

faz44
16-11-14, 11:30 PM
There might be a third option, which is to look at the OTL and work out which tactics do reasonably well, say average 72-76 pts per season. Turn those tactics into PCT files (there's a converter somewhere) and create your own "somewhat harder" AI tactics?

samsami
17-11-14, 07:36 AM
I wondered about that. Because renaming does not work. Wonder where I can find the converter.
Anybody?

Dermotron
17-11-14, 11:27 AM
I don't think one has ever existed. It can be done manually though

faz44
17-11-14, 12:03 PM
I think I'm confused, I think the Converter I had at some point (probably 2004?) was PCT to TCT.

Dermotron
17-11-14, 12:15 PM
Be great if there was, save us having to ask Tapani to make these changes - http://www.champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=5296

Ruben_
17-11-14, 07:16 PM
There is a tool somewhere on this forum which lets you convert human tactics to AI tactics. I used it to make basically every AI tactic some supertactic. Game is now hard as hell even with Iodine tactics. I managed to relegate with Chelsea using iodine_CF against AI tactics full of the top 30 tactics in the tactics league :P

info0
17-11-14, 10:50 PM
http://www.mediafire.com/download/bde6dzbh08n381w/TacticsHarderThanEverBeforeAlpha.rar

Here it is. Still downloadable, people did forget I made one of those? :P

Hell, if you searched the forum you would have found your solution. It's simple ;)

http://www.champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=2683&p=87200#post87200

Dermotron
18-11-14, 10:01 AM
People are looking for a .tct to .pct convertor, not the tactics pack, thats in the Download section already

samsami
18-11-14, 10:33 AM
Exactly. Having a .tct to .pct tool would be perfect.
You could then create your own tactics (TCT) and convert them to AI tactics (PCT).
So please? Anyone?

info0
18-11-14, 12:41 PM
Yes, you can. It's explained for Gods sake how to do it.

You need hex editor and if I recall JohnLocke posted a converter link in my thread. Yes, AI can use such converted tactics. You cannot just rename them (only changing first offsets does the trick and renaming to pct). ;)

But you need to replace the tactics AI uses under same name. Otherwise it won't work as those are hard coded into exe :/.

Dermotron
18-11-14, 02:03 PM
Surely a bit more to it than that. I've changed Urban Legend into a pct and the AI is just dodging using it completely.

samsami
18-11-14, 05:26 PM
Any PCT you want the AI to use should not be added (as an extra tactic) but should replace one of the existing PCT files or it will be ingnored by the program. Only the 40 PCT's (their exact names) will be read by the program.

Dermotron
18-11-14, 05:39 PM
That's what I done and set the AI manager to use the formation but it just choose an alternative existing pct. e.g. changed Urban Legend.tct to sweeper_v1.pct, sweeper_default.pct, 41212_v1.pct, 433_default.pct, 4132.pct and 4312.pct and set the AI manager to 433 or 532 sweeper but he just choose an existing formation (442)

Ruben_
18-11-14, 07:09 PM
i've seen ai manager use all tactics when using the johnlocke converter, so that's weird

Dermotron
19-11-14, 12:12 AM
i've seen ai manager use all tactics when using the johnlocke converter, so that's weird

Here is said convertor - http://www.champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=18 - was mistakenly listed as CM Tactitus Editor

marklt31
30-11-14, 03:50 PM
I have been using the tapani 442 tatic and am pretty much winning everything so not changed tatics .... but its getting boring can I turn of the wib wob thing like above and does that include the AI not using it

marklt31
30-11-14, 03:56 PM
So for realism use no wib/wobbling

marklt31
30-11-14, 05:30 PM
I downloaded the non wib/wob and its still on the game :-(

samsami
30-11-14, 07:53 PM
Make sure that the tactics in the data folder are the default tactics from 2001.
Those are the non wib/wob tactics and when you start a new game the program will use those.

What we are talking about here is having wib/wob tactics for the computer to use (in the data folder) which forces you to use a wib/wob tactic as well if you want to survive.

info0
30-11-14, 07:57 PM
Download the pack I posted above. Overwrite the files in CM0102\Data folder (where the game is installed).I can guarantee at least, that iodine based tactics won't do that well...

marklt31
30-11-14, 08:07 PM
I Have just re installed the game and the oct update with 3.9.68 and tap 2.19.2 patch I take it this will have the wob wib as i haven't run it yet

marklt31
01-12-14, 01:43 AM
Guys I have installed the update and the 3.6.68 . Then after that the 2.19.2 .. Id there any way I can get rid of WIB/WoB for players and AI So its just formations etc etc to make the new date more real plz

Fods
01-12-14, 02:53 AM
The tactics shouldnt be wib-wobbed should they....

marklt31
01-12-14, 02:57 AM
everyone has it i cant turn them off the formation

Fods
01-12-14, 03:00 AM
When you install 2.19.2 patch and open te atched can you disable "enable harder AI Tactics" ?

marklt31
01-12-14, 03:02 AM
I didnt see it

Fods
01-12-14, 08:23 AM
Maybe try?

eddieC
01-12-14, 05:58 PM
Maybe try?

Maybe....... fly?

marklt31
01-12-14, 07:14 PM
cheers

marklt31
01-12-14, 07:25 PM
the option is greyed out so cant

info0
01-12-14, 10:46 PM
Someone moved this thread :lol:.

http://www.mediafire.com/download/u9uulx5hk5vovgb/NonWibWobGoodies.rar

But here was the pack I mentioned. Just replace in CM Data folder.

marklt31
02-12-14, 06:40 PM
Have done buddy much harder ty

samsami
09-12-14, 02:04 PM
If you are using Wib/Wob tactics and find the game too easy now, here is a pack I have made to beef up the AI tactics.

You need to copy the files from this pack and paste them to your programme's Data folder or directory.

If the default AI tactics have an average strength of 50+ the pack I made has an average strength of 80+

AI tactics 80:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/31599853/AI_tactics_80.zip

(Ratings are based on the OTL table)

Samsami

AndyO68
23-01-15, 01:35 PM
Just by way of introduction, I'm Andy. I live in Newcastle but actually support Sunderland (Defoe the saviour!?).

Anyway, I originally started playing CM when I was a kid in the early 90s when all of the players were simulated rather than based on real people. I pretty much bought every version since then culminating in 01/02. It was at this point, though, that I went to college and finally managed kick the habit.

A couple of years ago, however, I started to fondly remember how much I loved CM and through my retrospective investigations discovered this forum. So I downloaded the game, the patches, a tactics pack etc. and began playing again.

Up until recently, I've always played against the original AI tactics, enjoying an enormous amount of success in virtually every conceivable context, using various WIB/WOB formations, most notably FuryOfTheBeast, 4411 Crusade and Prime Suspect.

Last week I decided I was bored and came back to the forum to see what I could do. I was delighted to see there was a harder AI tactics download - the perfect solution I thought, to make the game more challenging.

I downloaded it as well as the latest data pack (September 2014) and randomly selected a team (Nottingham Forrest).

In my first season I decided to play 4411 Crusade against the harder AI tactics and was literally over the moon when I finished the season in a pathetic 11th place, with a win rate of only 39%. At last, I thought, the game is more like reality!

I thought I'd change things around in my second season though and reverted to Prime Suspect. I'm currently 26 games into the season and find myself comfortably top of the league, having only lost 3 times. This is not what I wanted! This is too easy!

Is there an even harder AI tactics patch somewhere, or is this as good as it gets?

Please help.
Andy

Mark
23-01-15, 02:03 PM
Welcome on board, Andy!

That was the very first CM, wasn't it? Made up names.

I'd say that using tactics that were made to help you gain success is making it easy for you. Try developing some of your own or avoid of wib/wob and you'll find it more challenging :ok:

BobMem
23-01-15, 02:05 PM
:welcome: Andy!

Great intro, I can't help you with the difficulty thing as I'm an idiot, but I suspect the easiest thing to do is stop playing with a wib/wob tactic, or at least try to develop your own.
Otherwise why not try some of the challenges in the Official Challenges (http://www.champman0102.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=161) section? They introduce a lot of restrictions which make the game harder, plus you are essentially competing against other people to get the highest score, rather than just pwning the AI :)
You could also try setting your own restrictions, see some of the Stories (http://www.champman0102.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=162) for inspiration.

:ok:

AndyO68
23-01-15, 03:30 PM
Thanks for your replies guys, and I suppose you're right!

Is the game quite tough when you play without WIB/WOB?

Also, is there a such as thing as a WIB/WOB tactic development tutorial?

How do you know if your ideas have been used before by someone else?

Redknapp69
23-01-15, 11:55 PM
:welcome:

nah - game isn't too tough with non wib-wob

Enjoy tinkering!

marklt31
24-01-15, 05:40 PM
How to i change the AI tactics back to normal

samsami
26-01-15, 04:48 PM
How to i change the AI tactics back to normal

Did you save a copy? If not you can download it here:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/31599853/Data_default.zip

Copy all 40 files to your CM0102 Data folder.

Fods
27-01-15, 03:20 AM
:welcome:

elhooli
28-01-15, 01:05 AM
:welcome:

I'm new here, also. I find taking a more 'european' approach and change clubs every 3 or 4 years usually keeps me interested. It does mean you need to run ~7 leagues, buy hardware these days can easily handle it.

I personally can't keep away from wibwob, but building it yourself from scratch will take a few extra hours to get there.

havier
22-04-15, 09:39 AM
Hi guys! I would like you to ask for help . Play the latest update using hard tactics patch and it does not matter what team and what tactics the results still bad . used IodinTsF and other wib / wob tactics useless. advise the tactics which can overcome this patch ? Only real) Thanks !:nod:

julaofckr
05-06-15, 05:59 AM
Well, it has been a long time..

I've started playing this lovely game.
So, I'm trying to Tapani the game and I cannot select to "enable harder AI tactics".

Why?

Mark
05-06-15, 09:22 AM
The latest version has this greyed out for me as well. Not overly sure why, perhaps he disabled this or it is already enabled within the game?

Fods
05-06-15, 12:52 PM
Which version 2.20.1?

Mark
05-06-15, 01:05 PM
That's the latest version for me as well that has the option greyed out - 2.20.1.

Eofinn
05-06-15, 03:04 PM
Dear mates,

I am looking for harder AI-tactics for the latest update. I do not use wib/wob.

I create a tactic and get along with it. I usually play a 3-5-2. For the new update I want to create a 3-6-1.

Cm01/02 bores me after a few seasons because it is much too easy so I hope you can help me.

Best regards.

Eofinn
05-06-15, 03:39 PM
http://www.champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=2683&page=5 from Info0

I think this NWWAI should be useful :D

Eofinn
05-06-15, 04:12 PM
How can I install der AI-tactics?

Eofinn
05-06-15, 04:40 PM
ok i got it :clap:

julaofckr
05-06-15, 07:10 PM
Which version 2.20.1?

Latest version I think it is CM Patch 2.20.1

I simply cannot "check" to enable harder AI tactics

Have any idea?

julaofckr
05-06-15, 07:12 PM
The latest version has this greyed out for me as well. Not overly sure why, perhaps he disabled this or it is already enabled within the game?

BTW, I've checked the in game tactics and none of the famous ones were there (433 Guga Barcelona, www2 etc)
So I guess that option isnt in game..

Fods
06-06-15, 03:01 AM
Even 2.16, 2.17, 2.18 & 2.19 patch, the harder AI was greyed out.

Maybe this was more of a feature in the 3.** series patches

Fods
06-06-15, 03:23 AM
You could try this, info0 created

http://www.champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=2683&page=5

julaofckr
06-06-15, 04:59 PM
You could try this, info0 created

http://www.champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=2683&page=5

Ty Fodster.
I will check this out and try it...

Sarfender
25-06-15, 09:48 PM
Hi all. I have replaced the normal tactics with the Harder AI tactics available on download. Do they work in a saved game or only from a new game. The reason I ask that, is because during a network game my mate decided to start using one of cams wibwob tactics(Fury of cam), and then went on a massive unbeaten run after struggling. Sort of ruined the game for me, so I uploaded the harder AI and it didnt seem to make much difference. Any help would be greatly appreciated

Dermotron
25-06-15, 09:57 PM
They would only change in a new game

Sarfender
25-06-15, 10:10 PM
Ah ok Dermotron. Thanks for replying so quickly. I take it there isnt any way to apply them to a save game ??

Dermotron
07-09-15, 03:15 PM
If you are using Wib/Wob tactics and find the game too easy now, here is a pack I have made to beef up the AI tactics.



Ever thought of making a tactic pack that isn't the very best but somewhere in between - like a pack for the AI that uses tactics from the 150+ ranking in the Open Tactic League or from the original Ultimate Tactic packs? That would make the game tougher but allowing a user to use their own wib/wob tactics without the need to use the very best tactics to beat the game. I have a couple of solid tactics I like to use but they are still quite strong so it's only a matter of buying the right players. With opposition tactics using better tactics but not incredibly strong it might make it more of challenge to size up what to do in different games. Like playing a tactic with 4 wide men might be a no-no against a fairly centralised 433, so a user would need to make the adjustment to combat the opposition like swapping to 532 or 352

churky
07-09-15, 04:54 PM
With opposition tactics using better tactics but not incredibly strong it might make it more of challenge to size up what to do in different games. Like playing a tactic with 4 wide men might be a no-no against a fairly centralised 433, so a user would need to make the adjustment to combat the opposition like swapping to 532 or 352

You're venturing into FM territory there, you do understand that, don't you? :D

Dermotron
07-09-15, 07:31 PM
Ah not really churky. I enjoy the opposition having better tactics but I've not managed to get any sort of pattern to them. Playing 442 Vs Urban Legend is more fun than default 451

The really strong tactics kinda ruin the fun a bit

dudajev
28-05-16, 05:30 PM
Already posted this in Tapani's patch 2.21 thread but since I'm unsure of the root cause of this issue I thought I'd start a new thread as well.

I'm playing with this patch and info0's Harder AI Tactics pack. I played dozens of seasons in different leagues and goal per game average is ridiculously low. Most recently epl champions had a total of 55 goals scored in season 1, 51 in 2nd, and then never went above 50 again for the rest of the 20 seasons as I ran it. More than half of the teams score less then 1 goal per game and 5-6 of those total less than 30 for the season. Any league running in the background gives realistic stats (Barca, Real 100+, Bayern, Dortmund around 80) but when I play in any of those leagues I get the same low avg. So I figured match engine - tactics, and I tried default tactics but improvement is almost insignificant. For instance, in 20 seasons EPL champs rarely scored more than 60 and just once over 65 (the record was 67). Is this down to the tactics, patch, or the combination of both?

Someone else with similar issues?

Dermotron
28-05-16, 07:25 PM
Of course there is lower goals, the pack uses mostly iodine based tactics which is the greatest defensive tactic ever created

info0
28-05-16, 07:49 PM
Unless he is using non wib/wob one. That would also be understandable :lol:.

Dagi7
06-07-16, 03:00 PM
I Cannot find the TACTICS CONVERTER (from tct to pct). Can anyone help?

I would like to create a AI Tactics pack thats of course its harder than the regular one, but not wib/wobbed. I like to play "non-wib-wob"-tactics and the AI tactics pack that is available now is to hard of course.. can anyone help?

samsami
06-07-16, 03:11 PM
I Cannot find the TACTICS CONVERTER (from tct to pct). Can anyone help?

I would like to create a AI Tactics pack thats of course its harder than the regular one, but not wib/wobbed. I like to play "non-wib-wob"-tactics and the AI tactics pack that is available now is to hard of course.. can anyone help?

http://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=18

JonnyD
07-07-16, 12:02 AM
How to i change the AI tactics back to normal ??? Please Help me!!

Greetings from Germany.

Dagi7
07-07-16, 12:07 AM
Install the game (one more time) in a new folder. Copy the pct. files in your data.folder...

BTW: I have been playing with harder non-wib-wob tactics now. Its amazing.. a gamechanger!

JonnyD
07-07-16, 12:11 AM
Download your harder non-wib-wob tactics??

Offside Trap
24-07-16, 09:55 AM
I read and post alot about Tactics, and wibwob/non-wibwob etc... everyone has their own view, which is fair enough. I just picked up the harder AI tactics pack, and it states, that its a strong pack, that even the likes of Iodine struggles against it

Do any of you use this pack, and if so, do you play wibwob against it? does it work? etc...

Rxx
26-07-16, 06:06 AM
I only use two or three tactics of the pack, to replace 5-3-2 Libero, Defensive Counter and another 5-3-2 version which I believe is the v3 or v4 version, I play wibwob against them and its a pain to beat!

samsami
26-07-16, 09:17 AM
I read and post a lot about Tactics, and wibwob/non-wibwob etc... everyone has their own view, which is fair enough. I just picked up the harder AI tactics pack, and it states, that its a strong pack, that even the likes of Iodine struggles against it

Do any of you use this pack, and if so, do you play wibwob against it? does it work? etc...

I assume you use this pack, created by info0

http://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=177

That is a strong pack indeed and it forces the computer to choose from a selection of strong to very strong WibWob tactics.
I have tested it and it gives you a real challenge. But not every computer tactic is equally strong. There are some 'weaker' tactics among the pack. In benchmark terms the tactics rate between 60 and 80 and they average about 70.
So each computer team may vary quite a lot from year to year depending on which tactic they pick.

Therefore I created this - the strongest pack available so far:

http://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=221

I created it in a similar way as info0's pack but with even stronger tactics for the computer. Average rating is almost 80 now and there are no weaker tactics for the computer to choose from.

I have used this a lot now and believe me, it makes the game a real challenge no matter what tactic you choose yourself.

Tierney-LFC-1990
01-04-17, 03:36 PM
Anyone know if you can beat the tactics in the 'Harder AI Tactics Pack' by using non wib-wob tactics? Or do you have to wib-wob to stand half a chance?

Also, are the tactics in this pack assigned to certain teams, with being realistic to real life? E.g; Conte at Chelsea uses a wib-wob tactic that is like his real life 3-4-3 formation?

Many thanks.

samsami
01-04-17, 04:14 PM
The Harder AI Tactics pack and the Strongest AI Tactics pack replace the default computer tactics with WibWob tactics.
So the computer teams are much stronger when you use either of those two packs.
Even with WibWob tactics you'll struggle against teams with better players than your team has.

The Harder AI Tactics uses some of the top WibWob tactics and some average tactics.
The Strongest AI Tactics uses only the best possible WibWob tactics.

Tierney-LFC-1990
01-04-17, 04:20 PM
The Harder AI Tactics pack and the Strongest AI Tactics pack replace the default computer tactics with WibWob tactics.
So the computer teams are much stronger when you use either of those two packs.
Even with WibWob tactics you'll struggle against teams with better players than your team has.

The Harder AI Tactics uses some of the top WibWob tactics and some average tactics.
The Strongest AI Tactics uses only the best possible WibWob tactics. Link currently does not work, though. I just let the admins know about it.

Thanks mate :-)

Offside Trap
06-05-17, 01:32 PM
So I imported the 'Stronger AI Tactics' and dam! its bloody hard. Cant get no consistency going at all, 1 good game on stats, then 2 bad, and so on. My own choice, and tbh, its made the game as challenging as ever, and with the update and Saturn patch too, its like a brand new game, with minimal flaws to real-life

I've tried the standard 4,1,3,2 / 4,1,2,1,1 and many others, just finding it tough to beat these guys. But onwards, as I continue to experiment all sorts and tamper with this and that

samsami
06-05-17, 01:43 PM
So I imported the 'Stronger AI Tactics' and dam! its bloody hard. Cant get no consistency going at all, 1 good game on stats, then 2 bad, and so on. My own choice, and tbh, its made the game as challenging as ever, and with the update and Saturn patch too, its like a brand new game, with minimal flaws to real-life

I've tried the standard 4,1,3,2 / 4,1,2,1,1 and many others, just finding it tough to beat these guys. But onwards, as I continue to experiment all sorts and tamper with this and that

Do you mean the harder AI tactics created by info0 or the strongest AI tactics?
The harder tactics (http://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=177) score an average of 70+ in the Open Tactic League.

The strongest tactics score an average of 85 (!)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/eu72pobej3t60t7/AI_tactics_80.zip?dl=0

Offside Trap
06-05-17, 02:00 PM
Found my zip that I d/l, its called " TacticsHarderThanEverBeforeAlpha" does that ring a bell Samsami

samsami
06-05-17, 02:17 PM
Found my zip that I d/l, its called " TacticsHarderThanEverBeforeAlpha" does that ring a bell Samsami

Nope, but I do wonder how strong that pack is in Open Tactic League terms.

Info0's pack: http://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=177

This is a strong pack indeed and it forces the computer to choose from a selection of strong to very strong WibWob tactics.
I have tested it and it gives you a real challenge. But not every computer tactic is equally strong. There are some 'weaker' tactics among the pack. In benchmark terms the tactics rate between 60 and 80 and they average about 70.
So each computer team may vary quite a lot from year to year depending on which tactic they pick.

My pack: https://www.dropbox.com/s/eu72pobej3t60t7/AI_tactics_80.zip?dl=0

I created it in a similar way as info0's pack but with even stronger tactics for the computer. Average rating is over 80 now and there are no weaker tactics for the computer to choose from.
I have used this in all of my stories and it makes the game a real challenge no matter what tactic you choose yourself.
Even with WibWob tactics you'll struggle against teams with better players than your team has.

So in summary:

The Harder AI Tactics pack uses some of the top WibWob tactics and some average tactics.
The Strongest AI Tactics pack uses only the best possible WibWob tactics.

Offside Trap
06-05-17, 02:24 PM
Okay thanks for that Samisam

I must of got the pack from here though, as it's only place I get anything to do with CM. Was only a few weeks back. This may be the case on yours and Info's, but when you first start a new game, all the default tactics are pre-set to wibwob, even the starting 4,4,2, where all the players are wibwobbed. I'm guessing this is the strongest pack, but possibly renamed maybe

But you're right, in really spices the game up, and makes it so much harder, which isn't an issue what so ever

Offside Trap
06-05-17, 02:47 PM
Got It! it was from Info on the Harder AI Tactics Download section

So you're saying yours are a tad stronger?

samsami
06-05-17, 04:01 PM
Got It! it was from Info on the Harder AI Tactics Download section

So you're saying yours are a tad stronger?

Quite a bit, I'd say.

Info's Harder Tactics rate between 60 and 80 so if a team switches tactics (even during a game) that could make quite a change!

Mine rate between 77 or so and 87 or so.

Offside Trap
06-05-17, 04:59 PM
Quite a bit, I'd say.

Info's Harder Tactics rate between 60 and 80 so if a team switches tactics (even during a game) that could make quite a change!

Mine rate between 77 or so and 87 or so.

Real daft question now then, I don't know really anything about tactic testing etc... so when you say 77-87 etc.. whats that mean exactly

samsami
06-05-17, 06:55 PM
Real daft question now then, I don't know really anything about tactic testing etc... so when you say 77-87 etc.. whats that mean exactly

In the Open Tactic League every tactic people create and upload is tested by De Graafschap (a mediocre Dutch team in the Dutch Premier League of 18 teams). The testing is done in holiday mode using the same save file each time and then they look at how many points De Graafschap have at the end of the season. That is repeated 9 more times for each tactic.

So e.g. 84 means that De Graafschap had a total 840 points in 10 seasons.

This is the thread about it: http://champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=5790

Hope this makes sense?

Offside Trap
06-05-17, 09:43 PM
Yeah it does, and thank you :)

ChrisWaddle
21-07-18, 05:41 PM
I'm assuming it's only new ones as I did it and I'm still thrashing teams with Cheltenham?

GFRay
21-07-18, 07:08 PM
I'm assuming it's only new ones as I did it and I'm still trashing teams with Cheltenham?

The new tactics will take effect in a new game. Your old save games will still have the old tactics in them. :ok:

samsami
22-07-18, 01:38 PM
The new tactics will take effect in a new game. Your old save games will still have the old tactics in them. :ok:

That's correct and it's actually a nice feature because you can share save files with others without it changing the strength of the AI opponents.

ChrisWaddle
23-07-18, 02:27 PM
Got it, thanks. One thing I did find with the original AI was once I figured out- or loaded someone elses excellent tactic it was a little too easy to beat the game, so this will add a lot of extra life and challenge to 01/02.

ChrisWaddle
27-07-18, 11:50 PM
I can confirm the hard AI tactics combined with tapni patch makes the game MUCH harder! I would say it makes it very realistic actually. I'm playing with Simon's 89/90 db. I struggled first season with Swansea, barely avoiding relegation, then overachieved second season, got promoted, but am now sitting second from bottom in Division 1 after having not had a win in my first 16 matches!! I switched tactics and am starting to improve but most teams are destroying us. I think beating the game on hard AI tactics will be significantly more rewarding!

ViK
02-12-18, 01:01 PM
There's a few tactic packs out there that replace the existing AI tactics with harder versions for a more challenging in-game experience.

Which one is currently the most comprehensive/ most challenging pack to download for someone like me who is giving the game a crack again thanks to the excellent Data update and new Saturn patch?

Thanks in advance :mullet:

GFRay
02-12-18, 01:07 PM
Yo ViK it's been a while you legend! :hail:

I'd say go with this pack from samsami (https://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=311). It's pretty strong and will give you a proper challenge. :ok:

Also scemoka made a proposition for making a new pack with the tactics that were recently submitted. You can find his suggestions here (https://champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=5925&page=2&p=412459#post412459). You might want to chip in.

ViK
02-12-18, 01:20 PM
Thanks GFRay for the quick response. I'll give it all a look.

Good to chip in here again! Life gets in the way sometimes and I hope I can contribute more soon :)

Offside Trap
02-12-18, 02:18 PM
Seeing this has prompted me into doing the same,I give it 2-3 saves before I revert back after some raging

jhanstud
28-08-19, 08:54 PM
Hi samsami,is there another link for the original AI tactics please as I cant get this one,cheers

Dermotron
28-08-19, 09:03 PM
Should be in the downloads section

samsami
29-08-19, 09:32 AM
Should be in the downloads section

The original default tactics?

If not, reinstall the game (temporarily) to another directory and copy the tactics from there.

Dermotron
29-08-19, 11:50 AM
Sorry, I read that as Original AI harder tactics.

I'll make a copy and upload it. Handy to have

https://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=377

sohu
18-09-19, 09:13 AM
I am using Samsami's Strongest AI Tactics v2 pack but I am getting the double mentality problem, as well as mixed player instructions. Anybody has the same issue?

Dermotron
18-09-19, 09:24 AM
That appears to be a bug with JohnLocke's conversion tool. The only method that really works is this - https://champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=12218&p=432352#post432352

sohu
07-10-19, 06:50 AM
I have made this Harder AI pack based on Scemocka's recommendations.
As tactics are converted manually, no double mentality or mixed player instructions issue exist.

https://www.sendspace.com/file/pejx9i
(https://www.sendspace.com/file/pejx9i)
or

https://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=383

kokolinooo
09-10-19, 12:00 PM
Hello, i need more challenge, so i am looking for the hardest possible AI tactics pack.
Thank you for your time.

samsami
09-10-19, 12:57 PM
Hello, i need more challenge, so i am looking for the hardest possible AI tactics pack.
Thank you for your time.

May I recommend this one: https://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=311

There are several, but I designed this one to be the strongest possible.

Ravanelli
22-10-19, 11:48 AM
I read the thread and there doesn't really seem to be a 'medium' AI tactics pack, or am I wrong? I am looking for a pack that's harder than the default tactics, but that is not totally impossible to beat with non-wibwob tactics. Actually, the tactics on the October update from last year (with the double mentality) gave a very realistic result in my save games. I hopped around jobs and when taking a mid-table outfit I ended mostly mid table, with a top team top and so on. As for the CL, I won it once in five years with a top club, so very realistic, and it still gave me room to 'overperform' when assembling a good team and a decent tactic, e.g. I took Sampdoria to CL.

Does anyone know what kind of points those double mentality tactics scored? Are those 65-70 tactics or are they higher? So that I can maybe assemble my own pack with tactics that score that number.

sohu
22-10-19, 02:43 PM
If you are playing with non-wibwob tactics, you may try one of the non-wibwob tactic packs for the AI. They are in downloads section.

paulfitz
15-04-20, 09:19 AM
Is there any downloads that are suitable for the March 20 update to make the AI tactics harder for opposition teams?

Iím finding myself 10 points clear after about 10-15 games every season in the premier league with my Liverpool team.

No wib/won tactics used and use the same style of play as in real life (switching between having a DMC and an AMC for certain games)

MaxiShagilko
15-04-20, 09:33 AM
Don't play with Liverpool, they are cheats!

samsami
15-04-20, 10:33 AM
Is there any downloads that are suitable for the March 20 update to make the AI tactics harder for opposition teams?

Iím finding myself 10 points clear after about 10-15 games every season in the premier league with my Liverpool team.

No wib/won tactics used and use the same style of play as in real life (switching between having a DMC and an AMC for certain games)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qpnekm81xm8g2al/AI-Tactics.zip?dl=0

It's a Wib-Wob pack for the AI's.

paulfitz
15-04-20, 05:42 PM
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qpnekm81xm8g2al/AI-Tactics.zip?dl=0

It's a Wib-Wob pack for the AI's.

Do you just extract the contents of the zip file into the tactics folder on the program files?

samsami
15-04-20, 08:16 PM
Do you just extract the contents of the zip file into the tactics folder on the program files?

Not into the tactics folder but into the data folder.

There's a readme file with instructions in the ZIP file

And it will only work with new saves. Current saves have the original tactics embedded.

samsami
16-04-20, 07:29 AM
Here's a simple thread about AI tactic and this pack I compiled: https://champman0102.co.uk/showthread.php?t=10233

paulfitz
16-04-20, 07:49 AM
Thanks Samsami.

Tactics loaded into the database.

Looking forward to a more competitive challenge in the premier league.

Addicted to the greatest game ever created again after a 15 year exile!

samsami
16-04-20, 08:40 AM
Thanks Samsami.

Tactics loaded into the database.

Looking forward to a more competitive challenge in the premier league.

Addicted to the greatest game ever created again after a 15 year exile!

You're starting a new save, right? Otherwise the AI's still won't use the stronger tactics.

paulfitz
16-04-20, 12:22 PM
Yes a new save, Will the new tactics make a big difference to the opponents?

samsami
16-04-20, 01:01 PM
Yes a new save, Will the new tactics make a big difference to the opponents?

A huge difference :)

You have to come up with a good tactic/formation and with a good squad yourself now!

If it gets too difficult, look here for alternatives:

https://champman0102.co.uk/downloads.php?do=cat&id=11

paulfitz
16-04-20, 05:58 PM
Opposition is noticeably stronger and the game is more realistic.

European teams are really strong

paulfitz
17-04-20, 12:26 PM
Mid level tactics pack required I think.

I canít get any consistency in the results.

Beat spurs 4-0 away but canít keep a clean sheet and conceded 5 to Brighton amongst other high scoring games

samsami
17-04-20, 12:28 PM
Mid level tactics pack required I think.

I canít get any consistency in the results.

Beat spurs 4-0 away but canít keep a clean sheet and conceded 5 to Brighton amongst other high scoring games

It depends on your own tactic. If your tactic is not brilliant you may need a mid-level pack as you say.

stuboy72
30-04-20, 09:00 PM
Has anyone had any experiencing of using any of the harder AI tactic packs in the ODB, or just in the current Saturn Updates? Just wanted to know how the game plays out in the ODB with a harder AI pack.

paulfitz
30-04-20, 09:47 PM
Should work with the ODB but no need for them really unless your tactic is heavily wib/wobbed or your using a cheat tactic to exploit the system (2 man central bank throughout the team) as there are many teams who are hard to beat such as Roma, Lazio, man Utd before fergie retires.

stuboy72
01-05-20, 12:46 PM
Should work with the ODB but no need for them really unless your tactic is heavily wib/wobbed or your using a cheat tactic to exploit the system (2 man central bank throughout the team) as there are many teams who are hard to beat such as Roma, Lazio, man Utd before fergie retires.

Yeah i remember those teams always been pigs to beat! I never used the tactics that exploited the match engine, as i was always able to create my own that worked fine. I know the original AI tactics where weaker than those that now come as default in the patches. I have used both Samsami & Info0's AI tactic packs in various saves on the patched version of the game, which make it harder to compete, but not impossible to challenge once who have got your tactic right. Also used Aeelon's non WIBWOB AI tactic pack, and again that is a good challenge, when playing with a non WIBWOB tactic yourself.

Just thought i'd ask in case the original game is affected in some way, by altering the default AI tactics.

Joster
31-05-20, 11:12 AM
You're starting a new save, right? Otherwise the AI's still won't use the stronger tactics.

Ah crap :( Started a game with Sunderland, became Champion in League 1 and Chamionship. Now struggling really hard in the EPL (11th, 7th, 2th, 5th) with the harder AI tactics because I'm using a non wib-wob tactic.. Wanted to go back to the original AI tactics but that seems not possible in a save game :(

samsami
31-05-20, 11:20 AM
Ah crap :( Started a game with Sunderland, became Champion in League 1 and Chamionship. Now struggling really hard in the EPL (11th, 7th, 2th, 5th) with the harder AI tactics because I'm using a non wib-wob tactic.. Wanted to go back to the original AI tactics but that seems not possible in a save game :(

The save game includes the tactics that it used on day 1.

Joster
31-05-20, 12:23 PM
The save game includes the tactics that it used on day 1.

Yes and the tactics used on day 1 are the hard ones which came with the March 2020 update. Don't think Sunderland will become an EPL champion in my savegame :D

mr_wolf
19-06-20, 11:46 PM
Using a tactic of Cam F's pack along with "Harder AI Tactics" by Info0, gives me a very realistic game. It's not easy (as with default AI tactics and a super one for you) but not unbeatable as well.

Now i'm playing with Deportivo La Coruna in the old database, gave my money for Yepes, Donovan and Gallardo, and while having a really strong squad, i am 5th in Primera Division before Christmas. I like the challenge...